User talk:Linguist/Archive2

Cover art for Clarke's Childhood's End by Richard Powers

Sorry but I had to reject your submission for merging: there is a mess-up of different works of art, which is also represented in the database. It happens occasionally that art is done again by an Artist for the same title. Christian Stonecreek 09:01, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

No problem. Yes, I had seen that there were different types of covers, but also constant art elements taken over from one version of the cover to the other (the crouching figure, the tree-like things). I had also noticed that merging different types of covers derived from one another was an occasional practice in this database. If this is not the case, then quite a few covers should be unmerged… Linguist 09:11, 2 June 2014 (UTC).

L'enfant du Metro

This CHAPTERBOOK record is missing a record for its SHORTFICTION content. Please add it in a record update. BTW, CHAPTERBOOK has no relation to "chapter book" (in children's publishing). It is a unique ISFDB designation for a stand-alone publication of a less-than-novel length work of fiction. Unfortunately, the name is often confused. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:51, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I'll try and fix that. Linguist 20:56, 2 June 2014 (UTC).

One other thing: I removed the synopsis from the CHAPTERBOOK title record to the SHORTFICTION title record, per ISFDB standards. (A CHAPTERBOOK record should contain no series data or synopsis.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:32, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

Boule de Suif

Re this record: NONGENRE is restricted to works of fiction which are novel length (40000 words or more). It should not be used for works of lesser length which are included in other publications (containers like MAGAZINE, ANTHOLOGY, and COLLECTION). If a work or two is included in a book which would otherwise be eligible, you can create content records for it, but you'll have to type them as SHORTFICTION. PLease update the title record, changing the type to SHORTFICTION and note that it is not speculative fiction, but published in a spec-fic collection. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:57, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks, I'll do that. Linguist 21:02, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

NONGENRE short fiction

With as many "NONGENRE" pieces as there are in this publication, you should have only listed the spec-fic pieces. The content records should be removed and deleted from the database. You have the option to list non-spec-fic titles in the record's Note field. You can use this record as an example of a nongenre publication with only one spec-fic content title. Mhhutchins 21:42, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Same situation with this record and this record. Mhhutchins 21:44, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Right. I'll try and follow the example, and imitate the action of the eraser. Thanks. Linguist 08:37, 3 June 2014 (UTC).

I accepted the removals. I didn't have time this morning to go through his bibliography to check the NONGENRE items and delete the non-book ones, so please be sure to do that. Thanks. --MartyD 10:24, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, no problem. Thanks. Linguist 10:26, 3 June 2014 (UTC).

"More Not at Night", by Christine Campbell Thomson

You had your edition of this book listed as "unknown precedence" and unknown date. My 1972 edition listed a printing history with one printing in 1961 and another in 1963. Checking Abebooks, I confirmed that the other edition was the 1963 reprint, and yours is the 1961 first modern edition.
        A question on your edition. You mention that the story "The Seven-Locked Room" was listed in your edition without the hyphen. That's true in my 1972 edition as well, and furthermore the author in my edition is listed as "J. D. Kerruish" (both in the TOC and on the story's title page). You have yours listed as by "Jessie D. Kerruish", but that might just have been from cloning it. Could you verify whether that's "J. D." or "Jessie D."? Thanks, Chavey 08:16, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Your're right, it is "J. D. Kerruish" both times. I'll correct it. Thanks for spotting this. Linguist 08:26, 6 June 2014 (UTC).

Except I'm not too sure how to go about it. Do I have to create a variant first or what ? Linguist 08:35, 6 June 2014 (UTC).

I've already created the variant for my edition. What you need to do is to add a new content item with the same name and title as the variant I created, i.e. this version. Then you do a "Remove Titles From This Pub" (from the Navigation column) and remove the older version of this story from the book. (There's not way to just change the title within the contents; you have to do this add & remove.) I'm not completely sure, but I think at that point you have to do a "Merge Titles", because I don't think it will auto-merge at this point. The easiest way to do that is to go to Thomson's summary page and do a "Check for Duplicate Titles". That will give you the option to merge some of her older editions of books with newer editions (a temptation you should resist), and the option to merge your story with mine. Doing this will, I suspect, help you learn some of the uglier sides of the ISFDB, but if you're reluctant, let me know and I'll do this for you. Chavey 14:28, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your explanations. I should normally be able to perform the trick (but if I can't manage, be assured I'll scream for help). Linguist 15:38, 6 June 2014 (UTC).

Cover art for Galactic Pot-Healer and A Maze of Death

Your recent edits on Galactic Pot Healer and A Maze of Death prompted me to contact who I suspected was the uncredited cover artist for both titles, Ian Miller. He confirms he did both covers. I've added the cover artist credit and a note to each. Thanks. PeteYoung

Great, thanks. Linguist 07:13, 12 June 2014 (UTC).

Adrien Robert

I have approved the addition of two catalogue.bnf.fr links to Adrien Robert's record, but the second one doesn't look right. Could you please double check? TIA! Ahasuerus 02:20, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

I have removed the faulty one (no permalink). Thanks. Linguist 07:16, 12 June 2014 (UTC).

Thanks! Ahasuerus 13:13, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

Cover art for Redenzione immorale

Just to let you know that I rejected your submission to add Grant Wood as artist to this book. I think you are right that it is an adaptation of his painting American Gothic, but that is not enough to credit him. It really seems to have been created anew by Bruno as there are small alterations in the faces and the clothing. There is the possibility to add a note to the artwork's title, though. Thanks, Christian Stonecreek 07:20, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I'll just do that. Linguist 07:25, 12 June 2014 (UTC).

Recording OCLC and other databases' records

Re this record: when giving the record number from outside databases, you should use the format "Database: 123456". This will facilitate the transference of record numbers if we ever create a field dedicated to that database. So an OCLC record used as the source for ISFDB data should be entered in the Note field as "OCLC: 123456". Thanks. Mhhutchins 13:55, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 14:41, 12 June 2014 (UTC).

Вий

Thanks for submitting the synopsis for Вий! I am afraid I had to change the canonical name back to "Nikolai Gogol" -- there are some technical issues with author names using Cyrillic characters, although I hope to have these issues resolved in the foreseeable future. Ahasuerus 05:22, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, no problem. Thanks, Linguist 08:11, 17 June 2014 (UTC).

Second Variety

Your proposed clone for the second Grafton printing of Second Variety appears to duplicate this record. There, the editor chose to interpret the "Published ... 1990" as referring to the original publication and made the second printing's record have date unknown, but it otherwise looks the same to me. See what you think. Thanks. --MartyD 10:54, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Oops, I missed that one (as it came at the end). I'll cancel my submission, and update this one. Thanks. Linguist 12:23, 18 June 2014 (UTC).

Vandel

Hello, I've rejected your submission for creating a variant of the first of the Vandel titles. The canonical name used is indeed Jean-Gaston Vandel, so there's (IMHO) no interest in such a move (except lot of work) as the "individual" authors won't have any sf production credited to their own names. The relevant data can be given in the note field. Note that this will avoid the classic problem of deciding "who wrote what" (cf. Andrevon's text on the matter) and the question of the real name of one of the co-authors (Douilly and Lyau give a different one). Hauck 10:31, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

OK. My problem was that there is no Notes field on the Author Record page, and that the relevant data would then have to be repeated with each title. I'll put a link to the Wikipedia page, though. Thanks. Linguist 10:48, 22 June 2014 (UTC).

The page "Bibliographic Comments: Author:Jean-Gaston Vandel" (to be created in this case) is just the right place to put such data (even if it's rarely used, but see here). Hauck 11:17, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll do that soon. Linguist 11:39, 22 June 2014 (UTC).

John Dough and the Cherub covers

I had to reject your proposed merge. One of the covers records involved in the merge is gone. Also, this cover is not the same artwork as this and this. --MartyD 11:03, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Did I put all those together ? I didn't indend to; I thought I had separated them into two lots. I must have done something wrong… Linguist 11:44, 23 June 2014 (UTC).

I think what happened was there were four covers, two of each. One submission merged a pair. The other submission merged all four instead of just the other pair. Then, when the first submission was accepted, that merge deleted one of the four involved in the second merge. Too many check boxes.... --MartyD 11:12, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Looks like one of those imponderables (or, as Brian W. Aldiss would put it, Intangibles, Inc.) I need to ponder upon. I'll try and merge the last two again. Thanks for the explanation. Linguist 11:56, 24 June 2014 (UTC).

Claude Seignolle

Added a license tag to this file. Mhhutchins 21:20, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I was going to do it eventually (but I had a match to watch… :-D). Linguist 22:10, 26 June 2014 (UTC).

And thanks for merging my latest submissions. I was trying to do it and wondering where they had gone to ! Linguist 22:26, 26 June 2014 (UTC).

The Green Brain

Hello, I've put your cloning submission on hold as your intended publication is perhaps already present in the db here, even if unverified. What do you think ? Hauck 14:25, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, thanks, it must be the same one. I missed it because I only checked the prices, and there was no 80p. It might be simpler to delete it and approve the other one, though (I think). Linguist 14:54, 27 June 2014 (UTC).

Yes, done. Hauck 15:51, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 16:25, 27 June 2014 (UTC).

Bohumil Kubišta's bithplace

Just an FYI that I have changed Bohumil Kubišta's bithplace from "Vlčkovice, Bohemia, today in the Czech republic" to "Vlčkovice, Bohemia, Austro-Hungarian Empire". The current standard is to use the name of the country of birth as it existed at the time, e.g. see Jan Weiss's Summary page. Thanks. Ahasuerus 16:08, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll bear that in mind in the future. Linguist 16:27, 27 June 2014 (UTC).

CHAPTERBOOKS

Please remember to add a SHORTFICTION content record when creating CHAPTERBOOK publication records. I've added them to three records you created for Claude Seignolle's "Marie la Louve". Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:01, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Also, you varianted the German and Spanish CHAPTERBOOK titles to the French SHORTFICTION title. I've unvarianted them and created a French CHAPTERBOOK title (even though there's no publication for a stand-alone publication in French of the work), and varianted the German and Spanish CHAPTERBOOK titles to it. Mhhutchins 05:12, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

The same two errors were made with the English edition of "Le bahut noir". The content record was missing from the English CHAPTERBOOK record was varianted to the French SHORTFICTION record. Unfortunately, the moderators handling the submissions failed to catch either error. (Two different moderators handled each of the submissions, the one creating the record with the missing content, and the submission to variant its title record to a SHORTFICTION record.) Mhhutchins 05:23, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for mopping up after me ! Linguist 08:10, 30 June 2014 (UTC).

Сказания о Дьяволе / Les évangiles du Diable

A couple of things re: Сказания о Дьяволе:

• It's OK to enter Cyrillic characters in the Publisher field. In this case we already had Enigma on file, so I changed the value to "Энигма"
• As we established a few years ago, Russian books didn't have cover prices in the 1990s-2000s

Everything else looks good, thanks! Ahasuerus 16:41, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Хорошо, спасибо ! Linguist 18:54, 30 June 2014 (UTC).

Il est une voix dans ma vie

Hello, if I correctly understand what you're trying to do (add the italian original title), you just have to go to the french title, use the "Make This Title a Variant Title or Pseudonymous Work" item and create (with the bottom form) a new title (identical in name in this case) withe correct date and the correct language. Hauck 20:04, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

This was what I was trying to do in the first place, except that I couldn't find the Italian title anywhere. This is why I had indicated by “(Italian)” that the title should have been in this language. In fact, I had seen a few titles presented that way in the database. Linguist 20:14, 3 July 2014 (UTC).

In fact this operation will create an italian title but without an italian publication. It will show on the author's page as _Il est une voix dans ma vie_ [Italian] only appeared as _Il est une voix dans ma vie_ [French]. So if you don't know the orignal italian title (if not strictly similar to the french one), it's better to leave the title only in french, waiting for someone with the correct information to add the correct data, like this one where I didn't find the original title in spite of my researches in english magazines. Note that tehre are only very rare occurences of such suffixes (two (Italian) in your pub, one (French), no (German), etc.). Hauck 20:23, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot. I'll abstain. Linguist 20:30, 3 July 2014 (UTC).

"Cœurs perdus" and "Comment l'amour s'imposa au professeur Guildea"

A couple of questions about your submissions:

• Shouldn't "Cœurs perdus" be turned into a variant of "Lost Hearts"?
• Shouldn't "Comment l'amour s'imposa au professeur Guildea" be turned into a variant of "How Love Came to Professor Guildea"?

Ahasuerus 22:52, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

That was what I was going to do, but I suddenly thought that the authors' names needed to be made canonical, so that the stories would appear on the right page first. It was late, and I must have been tired : too many matches to watch… :o) Linguist 09:25, 4 July 2014 (UTC).

I will cancel the submissions and start again. Linguist 09:39, 4 July 2014 (UTC).

Looks good, thanks! Ahasuerus 15:05, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, better to not edit after the match (I'll take this to my heart for a few weeks). My bet is a 2:1, but I don't know for which team. Stonecreek 15:22, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

Ha ! :oD Linguist 15:38, 4 July 2014 (UTC).

Translators

Hello, I wish to advise caution when entering data about translators at the title level as you're doing now. I'm approving your submissions but there may be some problems ahead. For example, in this case the translator given as title level is Maria Canavaggia but the credit in Fiction #114 is to Marie Canavaggia. Here we've only got a varation of the surmane but indicating a translator a the title level without having verified all the occurences may lead to errors (e.g. if it's a completely different person involved). The translator problem will likely be addressed in the future (probably with a dedicated field). For the time being, IMHO we'd better stick to the publication level. Hauck 14:06, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

I systematically check elsewhere to see if it is the same translator. I must have missed the Marie / Maria variation, though. Note that here, the translator of this story in Fiction is credited as Maria. Linguist 14:12, 4 July 2014 (UTC).

Yes, but in this case the "here" is in error (note also that the translator is visibly at the publication level for noosfere) as are other things in this publication even if the issue is marked as verified. Hauck 14:16, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

OK. My concern in adding these credits was precisely to prevent future merging of similar titles with different translators, though. Linguist 14:24, 4 July 2014 (UTC).

That's exactly as I see it. Just take van Vogt's popular Slan that got so often translated under this very title, that it is essential to include the translator at the title level, at least in my eyes. And another case comes to mind: a work gets published under a new title using an earlier translation: then we would assign the publication date of that first translation to the new title, because it is the same text that gets published (just like any work that gets published under a new title in its original language). Here, it is also essential to know the translator at title level. Variant spellings of the translator should be noted, though. Stonecreek 15:00, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

I have been working under the assumption that two titles are variants if they have different translators. So to prevent merging of identically named titles, I have always been putting the translator into the title record. Then if somebody does try to merge them, they see the "Which of these two notes do you want to keep" message, which points out that there are two different translators. If this is not what we're supposed to be doing, than I've made one heck of a lot of mistakes. Chavey 16:07, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

La Truie: et autres histoires secrètes

Hello, concerning your veridied pub, I've acquired another printing of the same title. As my copy is starless (none on spine nor on bc) and the last title of the catalogue being #393, this leads me to strongly believe that your copy is in fact a later printing and not the original (1972) one. Concerning the star system of pricing category, it seems to have appeared between #414 (which is starless) and #417 (with stars) and used for the reprintings of earlier titles (e.g. this one). Can you have a look at your copy, especially the list of titles, to see if my analysis is correct ?. Thanks. Hauck 10:20, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

I've just had a look at the book : it seems in all points identical with yours, apart from the stars. The list of books at the end must have been reprinted as was, for it also ends with #393. No mention at the beginning of later Owen books either, such as Pitié pour les ombres (#448, 1973) or Le rat Kavar (#515, 1975). Sorry this doesn't seem to be of any help. Linguist 10:08, 7 July 2014 (UTC).

It might be interesting to have somewhere a chronological summary of the successive Marabout characteristics (and probably those of some other French publishers as well), to make dating (even relative dating) easier. When you talk of the appearance of the star system, do you mean on the spine ? Because the earlier starless-spined ones usually have black stars on their bc. Linguist 10:28, 7 July 2014 (UTC).

Dragonsong

Re this publication: Is the map on page [6] (according to the content record) or page [7] (according to the Note field)? Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 14:18, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Sorry. I see now that it states the credit is on page [7]. Mhhutchins 14:19, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

[after conflict] No problem : the map is on p. 6 and 7; it is credited on p. 7. Linguist 14:21, 8 July 2014 (UTC).

I've adjusted the note to say that the map appears on both pages. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:48, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 16:06, 8 July 2014 (UTC).

David Roe

I've rejected your edit to make "Dave Roe" a pseudonym of "David Roe" and instead changed the single pub that credited "Dave" to "David". That pub was an unverified pub that sourced a later edition for its information. However, all the verified Corgi pubs state the cover artist was uncredited and that the source is an external source (an Anne McCaffrey website). It seems unlikely that the original pub was credited as "Dave" and this was instead a typo in the database. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 15:45, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 16:07, 8 July 2014 (UTC).

Pu Songling

I had to reject your submission to make P'u Sung-Ling into a pseudonym of Pu Songling, because that is currently a parent record with two pseudonyms. If you intend to make Pu Songling into the parent, you will have to remove the two pseudonyms from P'u Sung-Ling, break the variant relationship of all of the titles, then make Songling Pu and P'u Sung Ling into pseudonyms of Pu Songling, and variant all of the titles under their name to the parent. If that is your intention, it would be faster if a moderator handled it, to avoid the wait time between submissions. Let me know and I'll do it for you. Mhhutchins 22:01, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

Yes, this is what I intended to do, as Pu Songling is the pinyin transcription. I had started removing Songling Pou, then I thought it might be quicker to make P'u Sung-Ling a pseudonym of Pu Songling, which obviously doesn't work. Thank you for handling it if you find time for it, but don't bother if it is too time-consuming : I'll try and do it the slow way… Linguist 08:35, 11 July 2014 (UTC).

Done. 37 submissions in 12 minutes! Please look over the parent page. There may be some clean-up. Mhhutchins 16:31, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Wow ! Thanks a lot (or were you trying to show off ? :oD). Linguist 20:33, 11 July 2014 (UTC).

Kan Pao

Kan Pao needs to be made into a pseudonym, otherwise a user going there won't see any titles and no link to the records on the parent author's page. Mhhutchins 22:20, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll do that. Thanks. Linguist 08:36, 11 July 2014 (UTC).

"Mujina" variant

I have on hold your submission that would make French Mujina a variant of what looks to me to be exactly the same thing ("Mujina", French, "Lafcadio Hearn"). I can't tell what the mistake might be (or if I am missing something). Thanks. --MartyD 14:36, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

My mistake. I wanted to variant it with the English original. I'll start again. Thanks. Linguist 15:17, 12 July 2014 (UTC).

I probably clicked once more on the bottom button instead of the half-page one. Linguist 15:20, 12 July 2014 (UTC).

Image of Frederik Pohl

I changed the license of this image from "PD-US" to "PD-author". Please note the difference here (check the history of each version of the wiki page). Thanks. Mhhutchins 00:41, 14 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot. Linguist 08:29, 14 July 2014 (UTC).

Fantastique, soixante récits de terreur

I accepted the submission adding this record, even though the wrong function was used to add it to the database. By using the clone function, you entered it under the title record of a work which has a different name: Anthologie du fantastique: Tome I : Angleterre Irlande Amérique du Nord Allemagne Flandres. This publication will have to be "unmerged" from its title record, which will create a matching title record of its own. Then you can create a title variant relationship between the two titles. (It appears that the one you just added may actually be the parent title since it predates the other one.) In cases like this in the future (when the titles don't match but the contents are close), use the "Add New..." function instead of "Clone This Pub" function, and then import the contents from one publication record to the other. Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:44, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanations. I'll try and clean up the mess once more… :o( Linguist 20:47, 15 July 2014 (UTC).

Sorting order

If there are two stories on the same page, you can sort them by entering the page number, then the bar, then a fraction of that number. So the page number of the first story would be "524|524.1" and the second would be "524|524.2". Mhhutchins 15:47, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Ah ! thanks. I was sort of experimentiong the technique, as I found the help page a bit confusing (must be my neurones still having a fit after the world cup). Linguist 15:50, 16 July 2014 (UTC).

One was correct, the other one wasn't. Try again. Mhhutchins 15:54, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

And thanks for merging the titles ! I was waiting for the previous submission to be accepted before starting. Linguist 15:58, 16 July 2014 (UTC).

You're welcome. I also had to merge the "extra" title records that you removed from the pub. I'm not sure how that happened. (Maybe a hitch in the system duplicated a submission? I can't tell.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:32, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

The unrecognizable character ï

The database software can't distinguish "ï" from "i". Thus it's unable to make the changes you're requesting. I'll leave a message on the talk page for Ahasuerus directing him to join the discussion. Mhhutchins 20:33, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, I thought my neurones were going bonkers again ! Yet, the same software managed to produce Haïti, Viï, Quatre contes du Leao tchaï tche yi and Tolstoï. Would I have to use the add-and-delete system to get that right ? Linguist 20:58, 16 July 2014 (UTC).

The underlying problem is that our software doesn't distinguish between "é" and "e", "ï" and "i" and a few other character pairs. Whatever gets into the database first claims that spot. Sometimes this behavior is (arguably) useful, e.g. when a search on "Tolstoï" finds "Alexei Tolstoi" as well as "Alexis Tolstoï" and a search on "José A" finds "Jose Azel" as well as "Juan José Arreola". Most of the time it's a pain in the neck since we can't have two separate records for, e.g. "Garen Drussaï" and "Garen Drussai". When we need to have two separate author records, the workaround is typically to create "Garen Drussaï" and "Garen Drussai (I)" or some such. If you need to change the spelling of the canonical name from "Drussai" to "Drussaï", the only way to do it is to change the name to an intermediate form first, e.g. "Drussai1", and then change it again to the desired spelling.

I know it's a pain, but the problem is not easily fixable because it goes to the very core of how the software is configured and used :-( Ahasuerus 21:36, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

[after edit conflict, so it may duplicate the above info that Ahasuerus provided]

It will accept the character if that's the way the author's name was initially created. But if you're changing a previously entered record, or adding one for an author without it, it thinks they're the same, and keeps the original use of the character. For example, Philip José Farmer is in the database with the accented "é". But if you enter a record using the unaccented "e", the system will match it with the current usage and display it with the accent. Maybe "ï" and "i" are similar to that. It's one of the reasons you shouldn't create pseudonyms and variants based on certain characters. Mhhutchins 21:38, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

ÖK, thänks ä löt ! Linguist 07:11, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

Original Chinese titles for Pu Songling

When I saw that you were creating parent titles for this author, I realized that some were in French, and some in English (older records). This made me rethink how the parent titles should be entered. So I changed the languages all to Chinese, and the dates to "unknown". Because I thought it strange that we kept the original English and French titles in these records for the original Chinese stories, I replaced the titles with a placeholder title until we can determine the original titles. It looks somewhat inelegant, but I couldn't think of anything else to stay within the spirit of the standards. Hopefully, you'll continue to research this author and be able to fill in the Chinese titles. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:10, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

I was more or less toying with the idea of doing something like that, but I wasn't sure how to go about it. Thank you for tidying it up. Linguist 16:14, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

As far as “Quatre contes du Leao tchaï tche yi” is concerned, there is no Chinese original : it is the title made up for the four selected tales published in the French anthology. The tales themselves, some rather short, are presented one after the other, with individual sub-titles, under this general heading. I think it might be best to leave it in French. What do you reckon ? Linguist 16:22, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

Ah-ha! So it should not be listed as part of the pub record, and be deleted from the db. There isn't a good way for the database software to handle these "group" titles. The best we can do is to note it in the publication record. If it's a permanent group title, meaning the four stories will always be published together, you can create a series of that name and add it to each of the title records of the four stories. Mhhutchins 17:12, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

Actually, I had started by not including it in the two later Anthologie du fantastique, and just mentioned it in the notes, then thought better (?) of it, and included it in the earlier Fantastique, soixante récits de terreur. So I had to add it to the other two, which brought about the two-titles-on-the-same-page problem. The stories form no series to speak of, just a grouping that is particular to the three anthologies. So I suppose after all that, I'll have to remove it… :o( Linguist 19:20, 17 July 2014 (UTC).

Identical Chinese title for two different stories

This story and this one have the same Chinese title. That doesn't seem right. Mhhutchins 03:15, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

Oops… I meant 畫壁 for the second one, of course ! Linguist 08:15, 18 July 2014 (UTC).

As 畫壁 "painted wall" starts with the same character (huà, paint) as 畫皮 “painted skin”, this other title by Pu must have appeared underneath, and I probably clicked on it by accident (I suppose). Linguist 08:21, 18 July 2014 (UTC).

Auss(i) lourd que le vent...

Hello, I've approved your addition of a synopsis for this title but shouldn't it be _Aussi lourd que le vent..._ instead of _Auss lourd que le vent..._ ? Hauck 12:50, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

Yes, of course ! Thanks, I hadn't noticed the typo. Linguist 13:07, 18 July 2014 (UTC).

Chanson de l'origine des connaisseurs

Hello, this title is listed as a novel. At 2 pages long, it's perhaps not the case ;-). Hauck 16:37, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

Might be a poem… I'll go and see… Linguist 18:57, 19 July 2014 (UTC).

Strange Stories...

Did you mean for this record to be Volume II? Mhhutchins 01:08, 22 July 2014 (UTC)

Looks like it… I'll update the record. Thanks. Linguist 08:04, 22 July 2014 (UTC).

Cover art credit for 1984

I am uncertain that the cover credit you want to add to this record is from reliable sources. It's OK to speculate about the artist credit in the Note field, but there's not enough evidence to change the cover art field. Is it possible to do more research to find a more reliable source?

Also, you shouldn't link to a listing on a sales or auction website, because it could be removed tomorrow without warning. Links to Flickr are also not advised because they are just as unstable. Mhhutchins 23:32, 31 July 2014 (UTC)

I have found this essay which seems to be more reliable, and is definitely more stable to link as a source. Even though I'm still apprehensive about this being a certainty, I'll accept the submission, and will replace the links with this one. Thanks. Mhhutchins 23:36, 31 July 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot. Linguist 07:56, 1 August 2014 (UTC).

Shagan and Junia

Hello, I've approved your submissions for a bunch of Brussolo's titles but I was wondering if the title of the series should not be changed to the more french sounding "Shagan et Junia" instead of the present "Shagan and Junia" (even if we're working in a english-speaking site). Hauck 10:40, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I was wondering the same thing when I had a look ad the other series. I'll correct it. Thanks. Linguist 10:41, 9 August 2014 (UTC).

Requiem pour demain

Hello, I've added the short story _Maskakrass_ to the collection, it was missing. Hauck 17:01, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks ! I must have been tired :o) ! Linguist 17:06, 9 August 2014 (UTC).

NONGENRE

Re this record: NONGENRE should only be used for novel-length fiction. Any non-genre fiction shorter than a novel should be entered as SHORTFICTION, and lengthed as needed. You should not include non-genre short fiction if the author is not "above the threshold", i.e. with considerable speculative fiction output, possibly outweighing his non-spec-fic output. So, if you're adding a publication which includes short works such I as described, you should not create content records for those works. Mhhutchins 18:06, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Sorry, I keep forgetting this nongenre rule about shortfiction. I'll correct the record. Linguist 19:48, 10 August 2014 (UTC).

Legal name field in author data

Should be in the format: LASTNAME, FIRSTNAME MIDDLENAME (if applicable). I've corrected the format given for this author. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:46, 10 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I noticed it too late ! Linguist 20:47, 10 August 2014 (UTC).

Œuvres complètes

Re this record: Can you confirm that the novel is not credited to the same author of the publication? Thanks. Mhhutchins 14:21, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

ALso, the cover appears to credit Lautréamont. Who is credited on the title page of the book? Mhhutchins 14:27, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

The novel is introduced by a facsimile of the original title page, and nothing else; it is credited to “le comte de Lautréamont”. The modern title page of the Œuvres complètes credits the lot to Isidore Ducasse. “Poésie I” and “Poésie II” are credited to Isidore Ducasse, as per facsimile of original title pages. Linguist 14:46, 11 August 2014 (UTC).

Thanks for clearing that up. It would be a good idea to add this to the Note field to avoid being questioned again about the discrepancy in credits. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:21, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

ISBN-13

I changed the ISBN of this publication to an ISBN-10, since the ISBN-13 didn't exist in 2002. Keep this in mind when using secondary sources which give both ISBNs. OCLC will usually list the stated ISBN first. Amazon gives both without differentiating. If uncertain, use January 1, 2007 as the dividing line between ISBN-10s and ISBN-13s. Also, if a book is more than a few years old, it's best not to use the current price on Amazon, because list prices are liable to change. I moved the current price to the Note field. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:35, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot. Linguist 15:45, 11 August 2014 (UTC).

Analog Two

A few months ago you left a note on my talk page. I wrote a reply, in case you are interested. Cheers, Patrick -- Herzbube ^Talk 09:41, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks a lot ! Linguist 09:43, 12 August 2014 (UTC).

Conan Lord

I have approved your submission of Conan Lord. However, I noticed a disconnect between the artist field ("Baconyi") and the credit statement in the notes ("Bakonyi"). It would be appreciated if you would review and make the appropriate correction. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:19, 14 August 2014 (UTC)

OK, no problem. Thanks for pointing this out. Linguist 13:22, 14 August 2014 (UTC).

Baxter's Raft

Your verified record appears to be identical to an earlier verified record, except for the Australian price. It would be a good idea to discuss this with the other verifier to confirm whether you have two different printings. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:16, 14 August 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll do that. Thanks. Linguist 20:24, 14 August 2014 (UTC).

They are indeed different records, confirmed by the other verifier. Linguist 08:54, 20 August 2014 (UTC).

ISBNs and checksums

For La fin des temps, the final digit of the ISBN is a check-digit, computed from the other digits. If you remove the 978, then the final digit needs to change, too. An ISBN-13 of 978 + 202051113 + 1 is equivalent to an ISBN-10 of 202051113 + 4. So if you want it to have an ISBN-10, then you should use 2020511134. --MartyD 12:01, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation; I'll update the record, as I was given to understand that there was no ISBN-13 in 2001. Can't see where the 4 comes from, though ! Linguist 12:20, 16 August 2014 (UTC).

It is computed from the other digits. See this explanation and this calculator. The ISBN-13's formula is different, and it has three more digits, so using its first 12 digits produces a different final digit than when the ISBN-10's formula is used on the 978-less first 9 digits that number. But as long as you know the ISBN-13 is going to have 978 (which for practical purposes, they all do), you can always compute one ISBN from the other. --MartyD 10:47, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks a lot ! Linguist 11:36, 17 August 2014 (UTC).

Neil Gaiman's "Witch Work"

Based on what Amazon UK's Look Inside is showing me, it would appear that Neil Gaiman's "Witch Work" in your verified The Mammoth Book of Best New Horror 24 is a poem rather than a story. Could you please confirm? TIA! Ahasuerus 03:06, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

Indeed it is. Sorry I missed that ! Linguist 08:33, 18 August 2014 (UTC).

I've updated the title record. Linguist 08:35, 18 August 2014 (UTC).

Thanks! Ahasuerus 20:22, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

The Fall of the Towers

You have verified this. Please enter the discussion on the community portal whether we can eliminate two title records that are included in your pubs. Thanks, Patrick -- Herzbube ^Talk 18:52, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

"The Devil Times Three"

Could you please take a look at this discussion, which touches upon your verified Planète, # 12 September-October 1963? TIA! Ahasuerus 02:58, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

Danny, le champion du monde

I've approved your submission but placed the book in the "Le Livre de Poche - Jeunesse" (instead of "Le Livre de Poche Jeunesse" which would have created a new one) publication series. Hauck 11:31, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. Linguist 12:45, 21 August 2014 (UTC).

An Investigation of the World of the Future

Hello, I've approved your submission for the changes to this title but set the language to "English" instead of "French", don't hesitate to correct me if I was mistaken. Hauck 08:43, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

No, that was OK; I forgot to change the language (and I think I just did it once more…). Thanks. Linguist 08:46, 22 August 2014 (UTC).

Yes, you did ;-). Hauck 08:55, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Someone Like You comments

Hi. Two things about Someone Like You: (1) Unless "[= Roald Dahl]" is actually done that way in the book, you should just use the name in parentheses for disambiguation: "The Author (Roald Dahl)". (2) The note about the contents' being completely different from the 1953 collection are best suited for the title record, where someone doing an Add Pub or Merge will see it. It's fine to have it in the publication notes, as you did, as well. Thanks. --MartyD 10:51, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll update the pub record. As far as the other note is concerned, I was going to do that anyway :o) ! Linguist 12:26, 23 August 2014 (UTC).

Charles P. Baudelaire

I think we have ended up with a few duplicate French titles under Charles P. Baudelaire. Would you take a look and see what can be merged? It looks like most involve either your recent edits or books you have verified. Thanks. --MartyD 21:51, 24 August 2014 (UTC)

I had a look at the page, and merged a few things. I don't think that I was responsible for many duplicates here. It seems to me that the profusion of duplicate titles comes from the fact that “Charles P. Baudelaire” was chosen as a canonical name. This seems incongruous in French, where the expected form would be “Charles Baudelaire”. Mentioning his middle name, especially as an initial, is a typical Anglo-Saxon thing ! Furthermore, there are quite a few spelling mistakes in the French titles (La Vie Antérieur[e], Brume[s] et Pluies, Alchimie de la Do[u]leur, Horreur Sympathétique, etc.), but it is difficult to know whether they are typos, or have been spelt that way by Clark Ashton Smith (who is the main provider of these). Not to mention that some translations of identical poems by C. A. Smith are credited to Charles P. Baudelaire as well as to Charles Pierre Baudelaire. These, I think, could be also merged without much damage. Linguist 08:44, 25 August 2014 (UTC).

I noticed that there were also quite a few titles stated as translated by Smith, with notes but without content. Merging them with the other Smith translations might also reduce the number of duplicates. Linguist 08:53, 25 August 2014 (UTC).

Thank you. I did not mean to suggest you had made the duplicates. I only thought you would be in a better position to judge than I. --MartyD 11:45, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

L'île au trésor

Hello, are you sure that 1) there are speculative elements in this work and 2) that this author is "above the threshold" (e.g. primarly known for his SF) ? If not, I'll probably have to delete the lot. Hauck 14:22, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

I put it in because there are already all these in the database, labelled “nongenre”. Or should they all be suppressed as well :o) ? Linguist 14:53, 25 August 2014 (UTC).

I'd like very much to (IMHO the ISFDB is too much cluttred with NONGENRE titles or complete bibliographies of authors who wrote only one SF-related book), in this case, it should have been directly created as NONGENRE, I've done the necessary adjustements. In this novel's case, such a level of detail is just a waste of time and space (but it's just my opinion). Hauck 14:57, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I had meant to create it as NONGENRE, but obviously forgot about it. Linguist 15:04, 25 August 2014 (UTC).

"Anonymous"

Is the piece on page 17 of this record explicitly credited to "Anonymous"? Mhhutchins 15:01, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Yes, it is ! Linguist 15:09, 3 September 2014 (UTC).

Just checking. Didn't know that the French and English words were the same. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:12, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Oh, is that what you mean ? Actually, it is credited to “Anonyme”, but I didn't think that made a difference. When you asked the question, I thought you meant “is it stated as « anonymous », and not just uncredited”. Should I change it to “Anonyme”, then ? Linguist 15:16, 3 September 2014 (UTC).

Yes. By "explicitly credited", I mean the actual credit as given. We consider "Anonymous" to be an actual credit, not just "anonymously credited". Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:25, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 15:28, 3 September 2014 (UTC).

Note in "L'autre"

Did you mean the date in the note in this to be 1893 instead of 1993? --MartyD 23:55, 7 September 2014 (UTC).

Yes I did ! Thanks for not letting this lapsus clavi pass ! Linguist 08:01, 8 September 2014 (UTC).

Gabriel Mourey

A quick question -- was Gabriel Mourey's legal name "Jen-René-Gabriel" rather than "Jean-René-Gabriel"? Ahasuerus 23:34, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Oops… Neither : it was René-Jean-Gabriel ! Thanks for pointing this out. Linguist 08:44, 9 September 2014 (UTC).

No worries, glad we caught it! See, those French lessons weren't completely useless :-) Ahasuerus 23:25, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Petit musée des horreurs

Re this publication: I'm not sure how this happened, but the contents from page 723 through 959 were doubled. Did you add those in a previous submission and forget? If not, I guess it was a glitch in the system. But if that was so, why didn't the contents from 964 through 1089 get duplicates. Those duplicate title records will have to be removed from the publication record, and the titles will have to be merged or deleted. If you need help, let me know. Mhhutchins 19:04, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

I only submitted this last batch when I got to the end, so I don't think this is of my doing; moreover, there's only trace of one submission for it. It happened once before I think, but I can't remember on what occasion. I'll try and clean this up. Linguist 20:31, 10 September 2014 (UTC).

Series' language

Hello, I've approved some of your submissions putting german titles in an english-sounding series, is it correct ? Hauck 15:42, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

I too found it strange, but a) stranger things exist in this database; b) the title of the main series (The Inn in the Spessart) was already in English. I personally would have put them in German, but I just followed suit… Linguist 16:10, 25 September 2014 (UTC).

Until recently, all we had was a few English translations, hence the name of the series. I have added the German name, so now it's "Das Wirtshaus im Spessart / The Inn in the Spessart". Since there is no software support for "variant series names", slashes are often used to enter variations like The Book of the Crow (UK) / Relic Master (US). Ahasuerus 10:52, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Les sept ravins

According to this biography, the Russian title is "Овражки" ("Ravines"):

• Прозябает Завалишин на своем степном хуторе («Овражки»), отгороженном от остального мира семью оврагами.

I'll go ahead and create the parent record. Ahasuerus 10:38, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks ! I was still hunting around for it, but you beat me to it ! Linguist 10:42, 1 October 2014 (UTC).

Satan's Diary

A few things re: this title:

• I have created a canonical title record, Дневник Сатаны, and turned Satan's Diary into a VT.
• According to the Library of Congress, the first English translation appeared in 1920.
• The name of the Russian-language publisher was "Biblion" rather than "Bibilon" -- see, e.g. this Web page. The Fantlab page for this publisher also gives the correct spelling, so the spelling on their title page must have been a data entry error.

Thanks. Ahasuerus 12:40, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks a lot. I knew there were some loose ends, and was going to come back to it, but I somehow got sidetracked. I'll go and correct what has to be. As far as the English translation is concerned, I suppose it must have been based on the ms, as it sometimes happens. Linguist 13:57, 2 October 2014 (UTC).

It seems likely since the translator, Herman Bernstein, was Andreyev's friend. Ahasuerus 14:07, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Accents

Hello, I've seen tests with accents. I'm not really surprised that it doesn't work. To my knowledge (not on the technical side but as a contributor), the site seems to have different ways to cope with accents (likely a problem with the character set used) so in certain areas (or when performing certain functions) José = Jose = Josè (try the search by name), in other places (IIRC the wiki) it's quite impossible to go from the bibliographic page of "René" (coded like Ren&e)to the author's page of "René". I was even stuck with two "Présence du futur" publications series which looked exactly the same on screen => "Présence" but one was entered "Presence" and the other "Présence". All this just to say that the problem that you were facing is quite complex and likely stemming from the coding itself. Hauck 14:10, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I was aware of the technical problem, but I thought I could go round it. Maybe one day… Linguist 14:42, 11 October 2014 (UTC).

When I come to think of it, I realize this is what must have happened when I did a bio page that would never link with the database. Can't remember what it was, though. Linguist 14:45, 11 October 2014 (UTC).

George G. Toudouze

I wonder why you varianted the single work in the db credited to George G. Toudouze into a variant by Georges-Gustave Toudouze. At the moment, there are no records in the database under the latter name. It would seem that until there's further evidence otherwise, the canonical author would be the credit for the single work in the database. That is usually the approach we take. As more works are added to the db, we can then determine which is a pseudonym and which is the canonical form of the author's name. Also, remember: creating a variant doesn't automatically create a pseudonym. At the moment George G. Toudouze is showing up on a cleanup report which finds authors with titles that have been varianted, but without an established pseudonym relationship. (That's how I came upon the situation, and checking the recent approvals list saw that you'd made the variant.) Mhhutchins 06:29, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

I varianted the name to Georges-Gustave Toudouze because he is mostly known under that form (see Wikipédia-FR), the usual variants being hyphenated (Georges-G. Toudouze / Georges G.-Toudouze). The spelling George G. Toudouze, with no hyphen, seems to be an Anglo-Saxon idiosyncrasy mimicking the practice of the abbreviated middle-name and, to my mind, a minor variant. In this particular case, I just forgot to create the pseudonym. Should I do this, or do you want me to revert to the previous situation ? Linguist 08:18, 17 October 2014 (UTC).

If you are sure that there will eventually be records for spec-fic work which are credited to the longer form of the name, please create the pseudonym. If you can not be sure, then revert the variant. You'll have to do one or the other to clear the error from the clean-up report. Thanks. Mhhutchins

OK, I'll go for the pseudonym. Thanks. Linguist 19:11, 17 October 2014 (UTC).

Europe

Approved your submission, just changed Pierre Versions into Pierre Versins and The Editors of Eurpoe into Editors of Europe. Bonne continuation ! Hauck 15:57, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot. Sorry for the typos ! Linguist 15:59, 20 October 2014 (UTC).

Poems by Perrault

Can you confirm that the three pieces that are typed as poems in this publication (pages 11 - 99) are correctly entered? Shortfiction records have been varianted to two of them. Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 22:00, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, they are : they are versified tales, which might have been translated into prose in foreign editions. They correspond to the first part of the book (see Notes) : "Contes en vers", i.e. “Tales in verse” (as opposed to the second part, “Contes en prose”). Linguist 09:16, 22 October 2014 (UTC).

We'll have to unvariant the English versions, since they're obviously not translations of the original poem, or even the same work if they've been that much rewritten. I'll do it. Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:31, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

I don't know to what extent they've been rewritten : if they are just literal prose translation of the texts in verse, I think they should be maintained as variants. E.g., Baudelaire's translation of Poe's Raven is in prose, each stanza becoming a little paragraph. But it is exactly the same text (mutatis mutandis), and it is still called a poem. Linguist 08:29, 23 October 2014 (UTC).

The publisher makes a point of emphasizing the fact that Angela Carter rewrote the original poems as prose works. That makes them sufficiently different to constitute a new work. We may even have to resort to giving Carter co-author credit. ISFDB rules about translated works were never thoroughly discussed before we jumped head first into those murky waters. (It's always been my contention that the variant function should never have been used to create translated work. An entirely new function should have been created. But I was the lone voice in the wilderness.)

Also, ISFDB rules only allow certain types to be varianted differently than their original type. SHORTFICTION-typed records can't be varianted to POEM-typed records. If push came to shove, I suppose we could make an exception. Mhhutchins 02:55, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Prosper Mérimée

Hello, I've seen that there are some NONGENRE titles by Mérimée, they should probably be deleted. Hauck 17:09, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll put them in the notes. Linguist 18:55, 22 October 2014 (UTC).

Brundage "Weird Tales" cover art

I'm holding your submission to "unmerge" the pubs from this title record. Are you sure that's what you intended to do? The art looks identical to me. Mhhutchins 20:47, 22 October 2014 (UTC).

It is, but the books are different (collection of covers vs anthology). I think they should just be varianted to the original, as I think they were in the first place, but not merged. Linguist 08:22, 23 October 2014 (UTC).

The record you linked to is a variant to the original. And you can't variant a record to a variant. All variants must variant to the same title record (the original). Mhhutchins 18:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

My mistake, I meant to link to this one. But what I mean is, I first merged these two, and I think I shouldn't have, even though they have the same title : they are different works. I wanted to unmerge them to make them separate variants of the original. Linguist 19:20, 23 October 2014 (UTC).

These two are the same work, credited to the same artist: "M. Brundage". They shouldn't be unmerged, because they are the same title, the same work, credited to the same artist. If John Schoenherr's cover art for Dune is reprinted in another edition of Dune, even if that new edition is titled Dune: 40th Anniversary Edition, we still merge them into one record. The same rules apply when an issue of a magazine is reprinted. Mhhutchins 02:47, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, my mistake again : I meant these two, which are distinct works (I didn't merge the others). Linguist 08:50, 24 October 2014 (UTC).

Yes, those two are distinct, and should be separate title records which will both variant to the same parent record. I'll do that for you. Thanks. 21:18, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

I've added a note so that other users won't mistakenly merge them again (they have the same publication year and exact same title!) Mhhutchins 21:23, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot ! Linguist 12:46, 25 October 2014 (UTC).

La science fiction par le menu: problématique d'un genre

Re this publication: Is the review on page 225 reviewing both volumes here and here? If so, please create a review record for the other one, make the necessary changes in the title field(s), and link each of the reviews to their respective reviewed titles. Ask if you need assistance. Also, is there enough information about the book being reviewed on page 226 so that a publication record can be created so that a link can be added from the review to the reviewed work's title page? Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 19:13, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Actually, the review p. 225 also includes this one ! I'll update the record. As far as the book on Jules Verne is concerned, the review only gives the year and the publisher, but I suppose that's enough to create a record. Thanks. Linguist 13:09, 25 October 2014 (UTC).

John Wyndham's The Kraken Wakes

I was just updating and verifying this printing of John Wyndham's The Kraken Wakes that comes before the one you verified. Mine works out to the 12th printing as well, so I checked carefully. My list of dates has a 1963 that you didn't list. Doug 21:05, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

You're right, I forgot 1963 ! Nice catch ! I'll make the necessary corrections. Thanks, Linguist 12:56, 25 October 2014 (UTC).

De watertrein

Are you sure that this title is in spanish ? Hauck 16:23, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

Not really… :o) I'll change it. Thanks. Linguist 16:25, 27 October 2014 (UTC).

"Drummer-Hinger"

Was this story originally written in Dutch? Mhhutchins

Yes, it was (but I don't know the date). Actually, when Jean Ray wrote in Dutch (or, for him, Flemish), he usually used the pseudonym of John Flanders. Linguist 16:57, 27 October 2014 (UTC).

La seconde invasion des Martiens

Please check the ISBN given in this record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:59, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Corrected. Thanks. Linguist 09:50, 29 October 2014 (UTC).

Sir Arthur Conan Doyle His Last Bow

I was going to verify this publication and wondered about a couple of points. My copy has no sticker and on the back cover, middle of the page about 5-6 cm. up is "3s 6d". Would this be a spot covered on your copy? Secondly, you have included his two novelettes, but not the other six 'cases'. I'd be willing to add them if there is no reason not to. Cheers. Doug 21:58, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Hello Doug. Yes, this is exactly the spot where the sticker is — which makes me remember where and when I bought the book (new !) : late sixties, at Brentano's bookshop in Paris, avenue de l'Opéra ! As far as the second point is concerned, I followed the instruction on the title page : “This is a non-genre collection. None of the contents is spec-fic and their contents should not be added to the database”. As the two novelettes were already in, I limited myself to those. You can try and enter the others if you like, but you might get a moderating rap on your editing fingers ! :o) Linguist 22:21, 1 November 2014 (UTC).

Added price, removed note about price and added note about pre-existing contents. I'll keep my knuckles as they are. Nice chatting. Doug 18:13, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

There's likely a problem with this publication (it's not linked to any title and doesn't show on author's page). Also as per the data present here I think it's better to restart from scratch via the "Add publication to this title'" item and delete the existing publication. Hauck 18:41, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll do that. Thanks. Linguist 21:03, 2 November 2014 (UTC).

Just to let you know that I reversed your change of this COLLECTION to NONGENRE. I also have some difficulties with this, but NONGENRE is reserved only for NOVELs. Thanks, Christian Stonecreek 11:07, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. By the way I don't quite know what to make of this, then. Linguist 11:12, 3 November 2014 (UTC).

That became a title without a publication, so I have deleted it. Thanks for the reminder. Stonecreek 11:44, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Le loup-garou de Camberwell

This collection has a content record also typed as COLLECTION. Is this possible? Mhhutchins 07:15, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

Yes, it's group of four short stories, collectively titled “Harry Dickson raconte”, that differ from the others in the collection as they are first-person narratives. I can see now this is a bit awkward, since it produces a title with no content. What would be the best option, transfer the stories from "Le loup-garou de Camberwell" to "Harry Dickson raconte" (which has no existence outside the book), or just suppress it and make a note about it ? Linguist 10:02, 6 November 2014 (UTC).

It sounds like a group title and not an actual COLLECTION as defined by ISFDB standards. If every story in this group is always published together under this title, you can add each of them to a series named "Harry Dickson raconte". Then create separate content records for each of the four stories. (Unless they're already in the publication record.) Mhhutchins 15:18, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

They are already in the record, and they have only been published once to my knowledge. I'll create a series if they ever reappear somewhere, and limit myself to a note for the time being. Thanks. Linguist 15:26, 6 November 2014 (UTC).

You'll need to delete this publess title. This should be the followup submission when removing a title contained in no other publication. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:56, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

Done. Thanks. Linguist 16:09, 6 November 2014 (UTC).

"Les plus difficiles de mes causes" in Harry Dickson XIV

How about the 2 page "collection" in this publication? (Pages 299-300) Is that correct? Mhhutchins 20:31, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

This collection is not two-page long, but goes from p. 299 to 373, and contains three different stories. They had previously appeared together under this title in a separate volume (the second from the right on the book cover), so it is really a collection. This is rather exceptional, as Harry Dickson booklets were really CHAPTERBOOKS containing one novella each. I would have made a separate record for it, had I disposed of more data (I only know that the collection was first published in 1935). How can I display its contents if there is no publication to correspond ? Linguist 21:42, 6 November 2014 (UTC).

Maybe your definition of "collection" differs from that of the ISFDB. We use it to type publications. Your use appears to be more of a grouping of stories (contents) within a publication, not the publication itself. How does the title appear in the actual publication? If the book clearly specifies that it includes a reprint of the 1935 collection, then the publication record (and its title record) should be typed as an OMNIBUS. As this appears to be a mixed-genre publication, it doesn't pay to spend too much time fretting over it. I'm just trying to clear it from the clean-up report which finds mismatches between content type and publication type. Changing its type to an OMNIBUS would do that. Thanks. Mhhutchins 04:49, 7 November 2014 (UTC).

OK, I'll do that. As I tried to explain above (maybe not clearly enough), "Les plus difficiles de mes causes" is not just an internal grouping of stories, but an actual collection with a separate previous existence, inferred from the reproduction of the cover of the original publication on that of Harry Dickson XIV; the date comes from nooSFere and BDFI. Linguist 09:58, 7 November 2014 (UTC).

Histoires fantastiques de demain

Note that there is already a record for this anthology (they must be merged). It will perhaps be easier for you to import the content (already varianted). I'm not at all thrilled by the numbering in the series (IIRC there's none on the book and it never appears later). This is likely a typical noosfere convention (coming from _Le rayon sf_) that has no basis on the book themselves. Note also that, nowhere on the book is the publication series "Autres temps, autres mondes" given. To be more accurate, the publication series' title is "collection histoires fantastiques et de science-fiction" (it will become "Autres temps, autres mondes" later). This is, IMHO, the main problem of speculative (i.e. without the books) bibliography. Note also that the precise status of Stryckman is unclear (by analogy with other tiitles, he's more the designer than the artist).Hauck 12:10, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, as none of the previous titles were in the database, I forgot to check for this one. It would even be simpler to clone the 1969 pub and suppress the one I have entered, wouldn't it ? As far as the other points are concerned, I'll make the necessary corrections. Is it all right to replace the publication series' title by the one you mentioned for all the corresponding pubs already in the db ? Thanks. Linguist 14:36, 10 November 2014 (UTC).

Yes to your first point (you'll also have to change the date at title level). For your second (third ?) point, why not, but without the books I tend to err on the side of caution. As far as the Dorémieux title is concerned, the publication series' title is on bc (it will be later on copyright page) and should perhaps be set to "histoires fantastiques et de science-fiction" as in this pub's copyright page. Note also that the distingo between the anthology (& collections in fact) and the novel series is purely fictive. It's only based on binding's differences and on the catalogues. The book themselves have only "Autres temps, autres mondes" on bc. Hauck 15:12, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 17:04, 10 November 2014 (UTC).

Identical cover images

I'm not sure why it was necessary to upload a new cover image file when it looks to be identical to this one. We should try to conserve server space whenever possible. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:28, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 21:29, 10 November 2014 (UTC).

Histoires fantastiques de demain

You'll have to update the dates of the titles in this edition. An anthology published in 1966 can't contain titles first published in 1969. Also, I had to delete several titles which you removed from the record, but failed to either merge with the existing record or delete. Keep that in mind when removing content titles which become "publess". Thanks. Mhhutchins 07:24, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

I'll try and clean up. Thanks. Linguist 09:49, 11 November 2014 (UTC).

Variations sur une machine

Regarding this pub, I tend to view the preface as a spoof one because of its unknown author, its unknown university, the pretentiousness of some of the claims (a critic of Bessière in Life ?) and its general tone (such auto-satisfaction and self-praising can be found for example in Bessière's autobiography). That's why I didn't enter it, considering if as part of the "fictive" universe of the text (IIRC other volumes of the series use similar devices). I'm inclined to delete it. Any thoughts ? Hauck 15:03, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

I hesitated between entering it or not, and opted for the “enter as is” solution. What about making “Prof. Hans von Schneider” a pseudo of R.-B. (+ an enlightening note) ? Linguist 15:22, 13 November 2014 (UTC).

This option will (philosophically) mean that fictive essays (e.g. in Foundation) should be entrered.Hauck 17:47, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I can see the point, although I wouldn't put this “essay” on the same level as the novel : it is, after all, Bessière talking about himself, just as he would in a “real” preface, and its fictive elements can be put down to a mere stylistic effect. But OK, I'll delete it and just insert a note. Thanks. Linguist 21:32, 13 November 2014 (UTC).

Histoires étranges et fantastiques d'Amérique latine

I added "(Histoires étranges et fantastiques d'Amérique latine )" disambiguation to Introduction. --MartyD 13:27, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

Thanks ! (Sorry, I forgot !). Linguist 13:31, 18 November 2014 (UTC).

Cover art "language"

I accepted your submission adding notes to Cover: The Island of Dr. Moreau, but I reverted the language change that would have made the language be French. I have to idea whether we have a standard, but I think the cover's "language" ought to be the language of the publication. That the artist is French and the art work is originally a French-titled painting does not come into play directly. If we wanted to record the French-ness of the artwork, I suppose we could then make a French parent coverart title and variant everything to that. But making a French-language coverart record for something never used on a French-language publication seems extreme to me; it's not something I would do. Feel free to bring up for discussion and/or to change it back if I've missed something in the standards somewhere. --MartyD 13:40, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

No problem. I just presumed that, indeed, the language entry corresponded to that of the artist, but I don't think that's a vital issue and worth one more discussion. This being said, I'm sure there are dozens of French publications using this exceedingly famous painting as cover art, but maybe not any spec-fic (although it is well adapted to fantasy fiction). Linguist 14:15, 18 November 2014 (UTC).

There was a plan a short time ago (which I can't find right now) to drop the language from most of the art titles, because there ususally is no language involved in the art. Exceptions do exist, as one would assume: cartoons with a language component, maps etc. Stonecreek 18:27, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

Pub date of "Insomnia" 3rd printing

I just added a first printing of the NEL edition of Stephen King's Insomnia (pub record reference). That first printing appeared 1995. I noticed that you have verified a third printing of the same edition, and that the pub record is dated to 1995. Do you have evidence in your book (or otherwise) that the third printing's publication date is 1995? If, as I suspect, you are relying on the copyright page statement "A New English Library paperback, 1995", then you must know that such statements usually refer to the first printing of an edition, even if they appear in later printings of that same edition. Since in such cases you cannot know the publication date of the later printing, the ISFDB convention is to set the pub record date to 0000-00-00 (link to help page). Can you please check your book and, if necessary, update the pub record date? Thanks, Patrick -- Herzbube ^Talk 16:25, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll do that in a moment. Thanks, Linguist 16:33, 21 November 2014 (UTC).

La brigade de l'œil

Hello, there seems to be twice the same publication : here and there. Hauck 11:01, 23 November 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I don't know how it happened… I've just suppressed one. Thanks. Linguist 11:12, 23 November 2014 (UTC).

Vingt pas dans l'au-delà

According to the Note field, this is an "Anthology divided into five unequal sections : I, Huit pas dans le cercle de l'horreur (first eight stories), II, Six pas dans le cercle du fantastique (next six), III, Quatre pas avec les « maudits » (next four), IV, Deux pas sous d'autres cieux (last two)." Shouldn't it be "four unequal sections"? Ahasuerus 02:55, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

I suppose it should :o) ! Thanks. Linguist 09:45, 25 November 2014 (UTC).

Storie di lupi mannari

Hi, I've put your submission on hold, because I'm not sure that this entry would be counted as OMNIBUS, it does seem to be much more to be a thematical ANTHOLOGY, considering the amount of SHORTFICTION it incorporates. And then there is the case of the publisher 'Newton & Compton'. There seems to be some similarity with the publisher of this book, even the imprint bears some resemblance. Could they somehow be unified? Thanks, Christian Stonecreek 05:08, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

Hello. I had changed ANTHOLOGY to OMNIBUS, as I discovered there were three whole novels at the end. I thought that was the criterion. But if it's just the number of SHORTFICTION that counts, then it's indeed an ANTHOLOGY. As far as the publisher's name is concerned, I had noticed the similarity with the one you mentioned, but as it was not worded the same way (no mention of “Compagnia del Fantastico” anywhere), I thought it best to leave it as it was. This seems to be like one of those Panther ~ Panther / Grafton ~ Panther / Granada variations. “Newton & Compton” could be normalized to “Newton Compton”, though. What's you view on the matter ? Linguist 09:30, 28 November 2014 (UTC).

After approving I changed the title type to ANTHOLOGY. It really feels more like it, just as A collection such as Robert Heinlein's "The Past Through Tomorrow" should be categorized as a collection, although one of the works is a novel (from the help pages) or like this book, which publishes a novel by the Strugatsky Brothers. I also changed the publisher as to your suggestion and the price format to x,xxx Lit as found most often for Italian publications, see for example. Thanks, Stonecreek 13:25, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

Thanks a lot. I hesitated about the price format, and followed the ISO code, but indeed it's better to harmonize those entries. Linguist 14:48, 28 November 2014 (UTC).

The two versions of "Meet the Author" (Jack Williamson)

Do we have a source indicating that the version in Startling Stories, November 1939 is the same as the version in Startling Stories, July 1941? The reason I am asking is that the text of these "Meet the Author" articles, which were very common during the pulp era, was periodically updated. (I have these issues in my pulp collection, but they are in boxes and it would take some time to get to them.) Ahasuerus 17:21, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

Better not merge them. I realized too late they could be different, and forgot to cancel the submission. Sorry about that. Linguist 17:24, 28 November 2014 (UTC).

No problem! Ahasuerus 17:35, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

"Dhoh"

It looks like something went wrong with the Make Variant submission for the Italian translation of Dhoh. It would have created a new canonical title in Italian, which is presumably not what was intended. I have linked the translation to the English record instead. Ahasuerus 17:46, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

I must have clicked on the bottom button again : I hadn't done it for quite some time ! Thanks, Linguist 20:05, 28 November 2014 (UTC).

Territoires de l'inquiétude

Re this publication: how certain are you of the author credits given here? Your sources differ, for example: Noosfere gives the authors as "James Graham Ballard" and "Thomas Michael Disch". While the cover credits "J. G. Ballard", "Thomas M. Disch", and "Brian W. Aldiss". BDFI gives "Brian W. Aldiss" in its listing. Until a primary verifier comes along, I would suggest using the canonical form of the authors' name to avoid creating false variants. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:19, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. As all these variants were already in the db, I didn't think it would matter too much in the meantime. I'll make a few corrections. Thanks. Linguist 15:28, 2 December 2014 (UTC).

The pseudonyms are in the database, but not the variants. Mhhutchins 15:55, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Christina Vilà ?

Hello, in this pub there's a text by "Christina Vilà", can you verify if it's not Christian Vilà ? Thanks. Hauck 17:54, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Yes, it is. I'll correct the typo. Thanks. Linguist 22:12, 2 December 2014 (UTC).

André Crépin

A question about André Crépin's essays in this bilingual edition of Beowulf: are they really in Old English? Seems unlikely, but you never know! :-) Ahasuerus 23:31, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Hı̅e̅ sindun in nīwe frenċisċe tunge ! I'll correct the language. Thanks ! Linguist 11:04, 3 December 2014 (UTC).

Maxime Benoît-Jeannin

By changing the canonical name of an author, you are changing every title record credited to that author. Since most of this author's work has been primary verified, you should contact those verifier's to determine if the change is appropriate. In the meantime, I've placed your submission on hold. Mhhutchins 15:19, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. Linguist 16:12, 4 December 2014 (UTC).

I think the road is clear ! Linguist 21:07, 5 December 2014 (UTC).

Creating pseudonyms when adding a new variant based on misspelled author credit.

When this title was made into a variant because of a typo of the author credit, a pseudonym should also have been created. Otherwise you get pages like this one. (This applies to all variants for pseudonymously published works, not just misspelled credits.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 07:30, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I had meant to do it, but just forgot about it. Linguist 09:50, 8 December 2014 (UTC).

Titles update for "Dimension Suisse"

Hello, although I've approved your submissions, I'm not sure that there is lot of added value in entering at title level data about a first publication that happened in a publication entered in the database (as is the case here). This fact seems quite clear when consulting the publications where the text appeared and matching this with the title date. Hauck 16:20, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

In my mind, this was to stress the fact that there were no known earlier publications, not yet entered in the db. But OK, I'll abstain in the future if you think it's not necessary. Thanks. Linguist 16:27, 8 December 2014 (UTC).

You're right about the usage, I've mostly saw such data entered when the first publication was "outside" the scope of the db (e.g. in a slick), in this case, a quick check of the publication date will (normally ;-)) allow an user to understand that it's the first printing. But perhaps this is just the concern of an aged computer user who is obsessed by storage problems (having started with 16Ko machines). Hauck 16:40, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

Sounds like the Apple IIc I started with… Linguist 16:54, 8 December 2014 (UTC).

Mémoire des Terres Mortes

Hello, regarding this pub, can you confirm the authorship given to the DELMAS couple (it's usually BELMAS), it's interesting to compare your cover with this one. Hauck 19:10, 9 December 2014 (UTC)

Indeed, it is Belmas on the title page, which I must have misread because of the cover (not expecting anything else). I'll correct the record. Thanks. Linguist 14:29, 10 December 2014 (UTC).

Wrong image license

This photograph can not be in the public domain, since it had to have been taken after January 1923. The link you give for the source (Wikimedia Commons) is an incomplete URL. Mhhutchins 16:57, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

Forgot to replace the link given in the example by the real one ! The Wikimedia Commons licence does state this picture is in the public domain, as it was released by the copyright holder (as explained on the picture page). Linguist 17:16, 12 December 2014 (UTC).

Marianne Leconte/Lecomte

Hello, can you verify if this ext is by Marianne Lecomte or the more usual Marianne Leconte (if it's the case, I've made the same mistake lots of time). Hauck 17:35, 14 December 2014 (UTC)

You're right, it is Leconte. I'll fix it up. Thanks. Linguist 09:45, 15 December 2014 (UTC).

Interior art title change in "The Drawing of the Three"

I took the liberty to make a submission that, if it is accepted, will merge three title records that all refer to the same interior art (by Phil Hale) for the Stephen King novel "The Drawing of the Three". One of the records that will be merged out of existence is in this pub that you verified; the effect will be that after the merge you will have in your pub an interior art content item that is titled "The Drawing of the Three" (i.e. using the canonical title of the novel), whereas before it was titled "The Dark Tower II: The Drawing of the Three" (using the title of your pub). I think this should be acceptable to you since your pub also contains an afterword content item that "only" uses the canonical title to disambiguate. However, if you object to this let me know and I will create a variant title that uses the title from your pub. Cheers, Patrick -- Herzbube ^Talk 16:09, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

No problem : go ahead ! Thanks. Linguist 16:17, 20 December 2014 (UTC).

Infection

Hello, in order to standardize the publishers, I've changed the publisher from "Milady" to "Bragelonne" and added "Milady" as a publication series for your verified here (on my Milady's titles the publisher on title page is given as Bragelonne). Hope it suits you. There are other "Milady" in the db but they're not PVed (and bibliographically suspect).Hauck 18:02, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, no problem. Thanks. Linguist 12:59, 21 December 2014 (UTC).

Names that include "de"

I accepted the submission updating this author data, moving the "de" to the end of the name in the LEGAL NAME field, and removing it entirely from the FAMILY NAME field. In the past, I've also accepted changes from other editors that did just the opposite. Dirk Broer who puts much effort into updating author data has made many submissions that added the "de" before the legal name. (I've invited him to join the conversation.)

Is there a standard in French that differs from other languages? Should there be a discussion about to handle such names on the ISFDB? Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:37, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

Another point to consider: the FAMILY NAME field is not visible on the author summary page of the database. It is only used to place the author in the directory. The question becomes whether the average database user that uses this directory expect to see Anatole Le Braz (for example) listed under "L" or "B". I suspect "B", but I'm looking at it from an American English perspective and may be biased. Mhhutchins 17:45, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

FWIW, the Library of Congress lists Lamartine as "Lamartine, Alphonse de", but de Camp as "de Camp, L. Sprague". The indices in my English language history books are inconsistent: some list people like Madame de Staël as "de Staël" while others use "Staël, de". Ahasuerus 18:17, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

In the Netherlands the so-called 'tussenvoegsel' (Infix: de, van, van der, het, olde, klein, groot, etc.) is considered a full part of the Family name -and thus is inherited-, but is not used when sorting names. This means that both 'Boer', 'de Boer' and 'van der Boer' can be found under 'B' in a Dutch index. A Dutch database will therefore frequently have four fields for the name of a person: Name, tussenvoegsel, surname and legal name . A Dutch bookshop will place L.Sprague de Camp under 'C' and Lester del Rey under 'R'. A US bookshop would have both writers under the 'D', as does the Science Fiction Encyclopedia. When I worked for IBM we were specifically asked to enter the 'tussenvoegsel' in the surname field because our English and American collegues could not find us when using 'Surname, Name tussenvoegsel' instead of 'tussenvoegsel Surname, Name' (tussenvoegsel mostly written in small characters in Duch, only in capitals when not used with the name, So Bob de Jong becomes 'De Jong' without 'Bob').--Dirk P Broer 22:46, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

Uses differ from language to language, as is evident from the above. To answer the previous questions :

1. In French, the preposition de, “of”, is usually not considered as part of the name proper, and not taken into account as far as alphabetical classification of family names is concerned : Jean de La Fontaine will be found under L in any standard dictionary. This has a historical explanation, as de normally precedes a place name, that of a medieval fief or a later estate, whether authentic or spurious. The usual practice among the landed gentry and nobility of calling each other by the corresponding place-name (Gilbert du Motier, marquis de La Fayette is just La Fayette, found under L) explains this situation — all the more so as de was very often a late, would-be aristocratic addition to a commoner's name. The preposition also denotes geographic origin, without any aristocratic implication; in this case, it would normally be capitalized and attached to the name (Decaen, “from Caen”, found under D), but as human vanity would have it, it was often transformed into a pseudo-aristocratic particle (de Caen, found under C). This French de (without any capital) must not be confused with similar-looking particles of distinct origins : in particular, the Dutch article de “the”, found in many northern French and Belgian names, such as De Vos / Devos “the fox” : in this case, de is capitalized, and the name found under D. Generally speaking, if the de element is not the functional French preposition de “of”, it will be capitalized, and the name found under D.
2. The case of the definite article Le, La is different : it is indeed part of the name, and capitalized : Le Braz will naturally be found under L.
3. Alphonse de Lamartine is therefore to be found under L; note that in French, he is usually known as “Lamartine”, nothing else (just as Jean de La Fontaine is known as “La Fontaine”). Note also that, although this is not mentioned in most data bases and similar sites including Wikipedia, this de particle is spurious, having been added by Lamartine himself to his awfully common-looking name : he was originally Alphonse Lamartine (a matronym denoting birth outside wedlock : “Martine's son”). Lyon Sprague de Camp should normally be found under D for, despite its French origin, it has become an American name; but French people would logically look for it under C. Madame de Staël is normally found under S, as her name is known in France under the French form of her aristocratic husband's, baron Erik Magnus de Staël-Holstein.

My view of the matter would be to enter each name according to the native custom, if known. It would never occur to a French person to look for Jean de La Fontaine or Madame de Staël under D. Linguist 22:31, 21 December 2014 (UTC).

It's a can of worms! --Dirk P Broer 23:07, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

Why not change the name of the field 'Familyname' to 'Sortingname'? Prevents lots of the above discussion points.--Dirk P Broer 08:57, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

I agree. Please start a discussion on the Community portal to get other editors' opinions. (This change would have no effect on the question of how to enter such names in the LEGAL NAME field, but then that field has no effect whatsoever on either title or publication records. In fact, I have no idea what its purpose is supposed to be!) Mhhutchins 09:05, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Le coup de pistolet: Traduit de Pouchkine

Just so you're aware: if you make a title crediting two authors into a variant of another record which only credits one of the authors, that title will not appear on the summary page of the second author. This story ("Le coup de pistolet: Traduit de Pouchkine") will not be visible on Prosper Mérimée's summary page. Mhhutchins 23:20, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I was hoping that would not happen :o( ! Never mind, it's mainly Pushkin's text, anyway, with a few tidbits by Mérimée. Linguist 10:01, 24 December 2014 (UTC).

Just to make sure. Is the story credited as written by both, or is Mérimée credited only as the translator? If the latter, then he should be removed from the author field. Thanks. Mhhutchins 16:08, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

The way the text is presented, Mérimée appears to be credited as the author : collection in his name, story appears among his own, nothing special in ToC. The only reference to Pushkin is on the title page of the story : Traduit de Pouchkine, “translated from Pushkin”, under the title. I see it as “my own version / adaptation of Pushkin's text”, more than a simple translation. Linguist 16:19, 24 December 2014 (UTC).

Then I would suggest not varianting it the title record crediting Pushkin. The variant function should only be used if the texts are essentially the same. (That's why I believed we never should have made translations into variants to begin with, but that's another matter.) By unvarianting it, the title will appear on Mérimée's summary page. Mhhutchins 18:29, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I'll try and do that. Linguist 22:53, 24 December 2014 (UTC).

G. Crès & Cie

I accepted your addition of Pickles. It created a new publisher "G. Crès & Cie". We already had a "Georges Crès & Cie". Both of these are from secondary sources. I would recommend they be standardized. Thoughts? -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:40, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

From the book covers I can see, it's always "G. Crès & Cie", but I suppose Georges might occasionally appear; I have no real preference. By the way, when I looked up the publisher's name as “Crès”, "Georges Crès & Cie" didn't appear (otherwise I would have used it). It still doesn't (with me at least) when I type "Crès", and the system refuses “Georges Crès”. Linguist 13:51, 27 December 2014 (UTC).

I changed the other pub to "G. Crès & Cie" as well. My guess is the other pub was entered before the database support for non-ASCII was improved. While it may have been displayed as "è", it may have been entered as "è" or some such thing. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 14:04, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

OK, thanks ! Linguist 14:06, 27 December 2014 (UTC).