User talk:Kraang/Archives/Archive10

Forward the Foundation

Intend to submit LCCN and page numbers for Forward the Foundation. lgtm lgtm Fjh 16:16, 2 January 2022 (EST)

Proceed. Thanks.Kraang 23:40, 2 January 2022 (EST)

The Forge of God / multiple covers

I invite your comment on this discussion. Thank you. Fjh 12:28, 7 January 2022 (EST)

Question on the Moderator Noticeboard

Could you please stop by the Moderator Noticeboard and comment on this issue? TIA! Ahasuerus 10:34, 14 January 2022 (EST)

Khare - Cityport of Traps cover

Hi, I saw on the recent edits page that you'd added an Amazon cover image to this pub added and PVed by another editor. Obviously it'd be down to them to confirm whether that image matches the copy they have, but I had an earlier edition of that title as I kid, and I was pretty sure that design of the Fighting Fantasy covers didn't come in until after the 1984-1985 ranges listed for that pub. A bit of digging around uncovered this page, which indicates that cover from Amazon is from 1987. (I think the copy I had is the one listed as from 1985, but I'm sure that will have long disappeared off to a charity shop, car boot sale or trash heap.)

Hi! Sorry for answering late. You are right. I have now uploaded a scan of my own copy. PortOfHamburg 04:16, 20 February 2022 (EST)

Thanks - nice to have some confirmation that my memory hasn't degraded as much as it sometimes feels like ;-) ErsatzCulture 10:45, 20 February 2022 (EST)

I'll ping the editor who PVed to this conversation for them to give the definitive word - I assume that it'd be preferred to have no cover image rather than the wrong one, especially on a PVed pub? Thanks ErsatzCulture 13:49, 17 January 2022 (EST)

Original submission had no image and all I found was the current one, but as you say its for a later edition, I'll remove the current image. Thanks! Also this submitter only has one edit and you may not hear back. Again thanks.18:13, 17 January 2022 (EST)

No worries - I really should get round to filling in the gaps in these gamebook series, although I think all of my copies of them are long gone. They do at least seem to be reasonably well documented online and in reference works. ErsatzCulture 11:59, 18 January 2022 (EST)

Swfritter's application for self-approver status

When you have a moment, could you please review Swfritter's application for self-approver status? TIA! Ahasuerus 09:20, 26 January 2022 (EST)

The Last Planet date

Mind if I change the date of The Last Planet to 1969-00-00 and add the appropriate notes? Per website "#47161 1969 $0.60 192pg 5th print". Thanks! Phil 11:35, 5 February 2022 (EST)

Change away. Great website I wonder if there's one for all the Ace books out there? Thanks!Kraang 16:05, 5 February 2022 (EST)

Submitted. I've only found this site for Andre Norton but who knows what's lurking out there? Phil 18:08, 5 February 2022 (EST)

Kinuko (Y.) Craft

I recently cloned Taltos and have had some difficulty with the cover artist, who is credited as Kinuko Craft in the book but this is an alternate name for Kinuko Y. Craft. So far I have made 3 submissions: [1] and [2] and [3], all of which have been moderated by you, but it still doesn't look quite right. I think I now need to merge 676737 and 2990607. Is this correct? It seems to have taken a lot of edits to get the desired result. Could I have done this more efficiently? Teallach 12:32, 20 February 2022 (EST)

Yes they need to be merged. If you look at the main title for Taltos(covers)[4] you will see the two identical variant cover records you have links to. To merge go to Advanced Search and click titles and search Taltos. You want Coverart results in this case the 2nd & 4th result(Parent Title & Parent Authors) match. Select and merge. This will fix things. Check Duplicates will not find this & it takes awhile to find and use Advance search for this sort of thing.Kraang 14:01, 20 February 2022 (EST)

Merge submitted. Thanks for your help. Teallach 15:46, 20 February 2022 (EST)

The welcome templateq

Hello Kraang,

When posting the welcome template, we should be using {{subst:Welcome}} and not just {{welcome}} :) The first posts a copy of the template so if someone edits/responds, it stays on the editor's page. The latter links directly to the template if you open it. See also the warning at the top of the screen of the template itself :) Thanks! Annie 12:58, 25 February 2022 (EST)

The Children of Anthi and The Omcri Matrix

Would you please look at the changes I'm proposing with these submissions for The Children of Anthi and The Omcri Matrix. In particular, please see if your copy shows a "Stated 1st printing" line on the copyright page of each one. My copies do not. Thanks! Phil 17:33, 25 February 2022 (EST)

I used "Stated 1st printing" in the past when there was less detail in the notes. Mine are as yours. I'll approve now. Thanks.Kraang 19:10, 25 February 2022 (EST)

I would also drop the "Stated 1st printing" line as it's no longer relevant.Kraang 22:06, 25 February 2022 (EST)

Books without sources

Hello,

Just a reminder that when you approve a non-verified book with no sources, a note on the sources needs to be added (usually the one where you checked the data in - if the editor cannot be bothered to tell us what they meant, all we can do is to verify where we know to look). I fixed this one, this one, this one, this one, this one and this one. All of them also needed the number of pages to be removed from the Pages field and the ASIN added. Thanks! Annie 00:07, 6 March 2022 (EST)

Had them on my list of books to get back to. Figured I just approve them & return later and fix them but have been busy approving submissions. Might take a day or a week but I'll always return to finish things. P.S. thanks for doing them, that list is checked off.Kraang 15:09, 6 March 2022 (EST)

Will go back & see if there are hc, tp, or ebooks to add. The submitter of these doesn't include everything that's available.Kraang 15:14, 6 March 2022 (EST)

Fixer finds most of the missing ones and I add them when he does - the different formats get loaded on a different schedule to Amazon though so they come in in different batches. :) Which is how I caught these - as the ASIN was missing, Fixer submitted a few of these again so I just untangled all of them so I don’t get more duplicates. Annie 16:12, 6 March 2022 (EST)

Exiles at the Well of Souls

For Exiles at the Well of Souls, do you mind if I change the page count to xii+337, add title "About Time ..." on pg [xii], and import missing titles:
Detail of Northern Hemisphere (map) (Exiles at the Well of Souls) on pg ix
Section of Southern Hemisphere (map) (Exiles at the Well of Souls) on pg x
Appendix: Races Referred to in Exiles at the Well of Souls on pg 331
About the Author (Exiles at the Well of Souls) on pg 337
Thanks! Phil 07:52, 15 March 2022 (EDT)

Looks fine submit changes.Kraang 22:53, 15 March 2022 (EDT)

Quest for the Well of Souls

For Quest for the Well of Souls, would you mind if I change the page count to xii+302+[1], add title "About the Author (Quest for the Well of Souls) on page [303], and import the following missing titles?
The Wars of the Well, Part II (Quest for the Well of Souls) on pg ix
Section of Southern Hemisphere (map) (Quest for the Well of Souls) on pg x
Detail of Northern Hemisphere (map) (Quest for the Well of Souls) on pg xii
Appendix I: Races of the Southern Hemisphere (Quest for the Well of Souls) on pg 293
Appendix II: Races of the Northern Hemisphere (Quest for the Well of Souls) on pg 300
Thanks! Phil 08:13, 15 March 2022 (EDT)

Looks fine submit changes.Kraang 22:53, 15 March 2022 (EDT)

Charon: A Dragon at the Gate

For Charon: A Dragon at the Gate, change the page count to [8]+289 and import the uncredited interior art title The Warden Diamond on page [viii]. Would that be OK? Thanks! Phil 12:34, 18 March 2022 (EDT)

The change is fine with me, if you have similar updates for other PV of mine just submit them. My original submissions had only the basic info and only later was the more detailed info being added.Kraang 23:40, 18 March 2022 (EDT)

Pyramid Giant

As a verifier of two Pyramid Giant publications (here and here). Would you please see this conversation. The question is whether Pyramid Giant is a publisher or a pub series or both. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 18:14, 18 March 2022 (EDT)

Entered these books back in 2007 will dig them out and check.Kraang 23:33, 18 March 2022 (EDT)

Sit Down Shut Up and Pull the Trigger

Hello,

About this one. Just a reminder that we record books with the authors as credited and when moderating we are supposed to make sure of that. In this case, the cover has "Michael Todd and Michael Anderle" and the title page of the ebook has the same combination. "L. A. Starkey" is not credited anywhere (and if any of the previous books is an indication, it won't be on the paperbook title page either). This editor has issues understanding how we handle variants and credits in this situation - so he tends to submit the books not as credited but with the actual names of the authors, especially when using AddPub. I've fixed it here so just heads up to please keep an eye for that. Thanks! Annie 17:12, 23 March 2022 (EDT)

PS: They also had the cover of the ebook and not the paperback - in this case they are different. Annie 17:14, 23 March 2022 (EDT)

Let me add an extra heads-up about Michael Anderle. He is a "packager" these days and his name appears on (literally) dozens of books every month. He is usually co-credited with another person, but sometimes the way he does credits inside "his" books is odd. It pays to check the title pages of any new books with his name on them to see how the ostensible authors are credited. Ahasuerus 18:05, 23 March 2022 (EDT)

Noted. Thanks.Kraang 23:03, 23 March 2022 (EDT)

Oops, needing Help

Hi. Moments ago you approved two of multiple Publisher Update Submission for Readers Union, with different mis-format links to an ISFDB.org target. After 21 months away I am reviewing in Help space some points either forgotten or easily missed by typo, and I wrote a note to familiar moderator Chris J, known to be currently at work. (I thought I would have quite the remainder of the hour, at least, given the length of the cue, where I have another Publisher Update.)
Now I recall Moderator noticeboard which may be for such as this User talk:Chris J#"Help!" from Pwendt.

(minutes later, twice) Fix one matter just above. And sign.

P.S. Chris J has approved the older submission, thus I strikeout abvove. And CJ may fix the other ahead of you or me. --Pwendt|talk 23:01, 25 March 2022 (EDT)

Palm Sunday: An Autobiographical Collage

Hi. You just approved my creation of title/publication:
http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?896101
I didn't mean to create another title, I was planning to use this one, already existing:
http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?1277638

I do not know how to proceed now. --Spacecow 07:18, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

Just use the "Delete this pub" and submit, a short note about why and the after its deleted go back & delete the Title Record[5], you will see it is then empty.Kraang 11:34, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

I meant to create the publication, but not a new title. Can i delete the title, leaving the publication without a single title for some time, and then import the correct existing title? --Spacecow 15:54, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

In "advanced search" you can merge the titles records. In "Advanced Search" click on titles & search "Palm Sunday: An Autobiographical Collage". You will get four results. Select the first 1981 that has the parent record & the third which is the one you created 1982 and merge the records. This will get your publication under the correct variant at the same time.Kraang 16:17, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

Thank you for your help :). I have 3 pending title merges now. I hope I did it right. --Spacecow 19:02, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

All approved & correct :)Kraang 20:41, 25 April 2022 (EDT)

Comment on my application

I've applied to be a self-approver, but it's getting buried in other comments. Please weigh in either way.

http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#Application_for_self-approval_status_--_taweiss

Thanks Tom 10:57, 2 May 2022 (EDT)

Publishers project you list

Hi. Does the publishers project you list for yourself refer to relocation of valuable info from Wiki pages to database publishers, and elimination of the Wiki pages? Or something else?

Occasionally 2-6 years ago I added info to one of those Wiki pages. Generally, I don't look at them and may not notice that they exist. I suppose they are much reduced in number, now in the 2020s.

Thanks for your attention as moderator. --Pwendt|talk 11:21, 5 May 2022 (EDT)

Sometimes added to the Wiki page but 99% was on the ISFDB publishers page. I've done a lot on the updates[6] and merging[7]. I'm still actively interested in this area and I'm always interested in finding things to fix. Need to update the project page now that I'm back from three year break.. Submissions keep me busy.21:36, 5 May 2022 (EDT)

Thanks

Thanks for approving my very first edits here. ATorsius 13:48, 14 May 2022 (EDT)

External IDs approval

Hello,

Just heads up and a reminder: when approving external IDs and web links, please check that they belong to the edition they are added to. That's part of why we have moderation - second set of eyes and all that :) See this one for example. Thanks! Annie 14:43, 15 June 2022 (EDT)

I do random checks on most submitters(left one problem child for others to play with) but after a while if I find no issues I only do spot checks. All new submitters I check everything. If every link has to be checked my approvals would drop to 10 percent or less and the moderator board is getting rather long.Kraang 16:17, 15 June 2022 (EDT)

May be a good idea to at least make sure you check them when approving changes to PVed books - not all PVs are always around to spot and fix the incorrect change and adding incorrect data to verified books is kinda making the whole verification process meaningless. Annie 22:06, 15 June 2022 (EDT)

Yeah, Special K, see the problem was that you ran through dozens of edits in a few minutes so it was clear that you weren't taking the time to look at edits closely and were just fulfilling a quota, and on the very rare (2 times) occasions when you rejected an edit you were wrong on both of them and they had to be un-rejected. If that's being a problem, hey, I got 99 problems but a Kraang ain't one. --Username 22:50, 15 June 2022 (EDT)

Beachhead planet / edit approval

Could you weigh in on [8]? Thanks. --Glenn 16:52, 20 June 2022 (EDT)

looks fine. Is there an issue with the change?Kraang 17:03, 20 June 2022 (EDT)

Nope, nothing wrong. You were entitled to a notifications as a PV. John Scifibones 18:00, 20 June 2022 (EDT)

Dimension of Illion

Today you approved my four submissions toward undoing Irving Heine as a pseudonym of Denis Hughes. Thanks.
I expected there would be leftover, never-published chapbook and shortfiction by Denis Hughes, which need to be deleted; but I don't find them. You noticed, and did that manually, I suppose (correct me if wrong). --Pwendt|talk 16:37, 1 July 2022 (EDT)

Yes I deleted the two title records, If your edits will leave a title record empty just leave a note to the moderator that you will do the title record deletion. Better to do them right away and not have to look at the cleanup report and wonder why it is empty. ThanksKraang 20:18, 1 July 2022 (EDT)

The Shadow Eater

Hello Kraang. I wanted to ask you about this publication. As you can see the UK edition I have is by A. A. Attanasio not Adam Lee. I know the contents part shows that fact but the publication metadata has it as Adam Lee. Should it not be Attanasio ? --Mavmaramis 15:57, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

I'll sort it out. It needs to be unmerged. renamed and then merged back with the parent title under A. A. Attanasio. Will do it now. ThanksKraang 16:24, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

Thanks. Sorry to have caused some headache. As you may have noticed I've had a lot of books tooling up over the past few weeks (mostly Attanasio's works). --Mavmaramis 17:02, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

Sandkings

Sorry to bug you with another question. It's about this edition of Sandkings.Copyright & title page has "Futura Publications". Copyright page mentions it being a division of Macdonald & Co. Oribt doesn't appear anywhere on the title page or copyright page - the Oribit logo is only on the cover & spine - note does state back cover has "Futura Publications (over) An Orbit Book" - do you think this enough evidence to change publisher to just Futura ? --Mavmaramis 17:09, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

No I would leave it as is. The note explains it and all the other books I looked at are very much the same.Kraang 20:33, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

Thanks. --Mavmaramis 23:44, 2 July 2022 (EDT)

Multi User Write Access Problem

Take a deep breath.
Recently, I made a pub update submission on Larry Niven's The Integral Trees, which you approved. Shortly afterward, Mavmaramis also made a pub update submission, which you approved. This was flagged up in My Recently Changed Primary Verifications so I looked to see what had changed and discovered that a comment I had added to the pub notes was no longer there. The comment was:
"Novel ends on page 235. Dramatis Personae on pages 236-237. Glossary on pages 238-240"
Hereafter, I shall refer to this as the Glossary Comment.
I immediately leapt to the obvious conclusion: Mavmaramis had deleted my comment and you had approved the deletion. (Blood starts to boil.... :-) )
However, after further investigation and inspection of the edit history, I don't think that is the case at all. I think the actual explanation is considerably more alarming: we have a multi user write access problem.
In chronological order, the sequence of events is as follows:
1) 2022-06-27 07:22:39 Teallach makes submission 5350157: PubUpdate
2) 2022-07-01 12:53:14 Mavmaramis PVs pub record
3) 2022-07-01 12:56:58 Mavmaramis makes submission 5353339: PubUpdate
4) 2022-07-01 14:32:43 Kraang approves Teallach's submission
5) 2022-07-02 13:15:00 (approx) Teallach visually inspects the pub record to check it has been updated as expected. All looks good. The Glossary Comment is present in the pub notes.
6) 2022-07-02 13:16:37 Teallach PVs pub record
7) 2022-07-02 16:40:16 Kraang approves Mavmaramis' submission
8) 2022-07-02 18:00:00 (approx) Teallach sees that The Integral Trees has been flagged up in My Recently Changed Primary Verifications, visually inspects the pub record, sees Mavmaramis' additional remarks and discovers that his Glossary Comment is missing from the pub notes.
So I guess what has happened is that during stage 3), Mavmaramis' submission took a copy of the Pub Notes field which, at that time, did not contain the Glossary Comment and added his own remarks. This was then held until stage 7) when it overwrote the Pub Notes field which, in the meantime, had been updated with the Glossary Comment. Therefore the Glossary Comment vanished.
Teallach's submission also changed other fields, such as the number of Pages. These changes have been retained. It is only the pub notes field that has been affected and I guess this is because that is the only field that was changed in both submissions.
Can you please advise whether you think my deductions are correct.
If not, can you please explain what you think has happened.
If I am correct then I have to say that I am extremely surprised that the ISFDb software permits this sort of thing to happen. Multi user write access is a well known, age old problem with computer databases. Prior to this experience, I had assumed that when an editor makes a submission, the ISFDb software would lock affected records, make them read-only and forbid another editor from making a submission on the affected records until the first editor's submission had been processed. I also find it very hard to believe that this is the first time this scenario has ever happened and that I am the first person to notice it. Teallach 14:07, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Just wanted to add my tuppence worth. I cannot recall if the Glossary Comment was present or not when I added two items to the notes. I'm not in the habit of deliberately deleting meaningful or worthwhile notes and if it did happen it was entirely accidental. --Mavmaramis 15:07, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

I've never run into this problem before(as far as I can remember, been here since 2007 so who can remember everything) and I've always been aware of the issue you are describing, but never realized it was a problem in databases, my back ground is not computer oriented. You may want to approach Ahasuerus since he deals with software updates. When I've noticed this type of deletion in the past on PV pubs I usually Hold and inquire or just replace the deleted info. With processing a 1200 to 1500 submissions a week a few mistakes happen, but all can be made well. I can see in history what is missing so I will add it back. Hope this sorts everything out. Thanks!Kraang 16:01, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Mavmaramis: The Glossary Comment would not have been present at the time you made your edit. Teallach 18:36, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Kraang: That's fine. I certainly wasn't expecting you to fix the write access problem. I just wanted to sound you out first to make sure I wasn't jumping to any daft conclusions. I will now draw Ahasuerus' attention to this situation. You did not make a mistake. The Glossary Comment would not have been flagged as a deletion in the warnings column of Mavmaramis' submission. This is a perfect example of why it is so dangerous to allow multiple users to have simultaneous write access. I have seen that you have restored the Glossary Comment today. Many thanks. Teallach 18:38, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

(unindent) Let me clarify a couple of things. First, re:

I had assumed that when an editor makes a submission, the ISFDb software would lock affected records, make them read-only and forbid another editor from making a submission on the affected records until the first editor's submission had been processed.

I am afraid there is nothing in the software that locks records upon submission creation. A single publication record affected by a PubUpdate submission can be associated with multiple author records; multiple (sometimes dozens or even hundreds of) title records; a publisher record; and a publication series record. In addition, a PubUpdate submission can change certain Contents titles' authors, dates and "length values". That's a lot of different records that we would potentially need to lock. Like most other software issues, it would be doable if we threw enough man-hours at it, but it would require a lot of work.

Re:

It is only the pub notes field that has been affected and I guess this is because that is the only field that was changed in both submissions.

This is correct. When a submission is created, only changed field values are added to the submission "payload". This helps alleviate the kind of problem that you ran into.

As far as resolving conflicts between what's already in the database and what's in the submission goes, we have certain tools which alert the reviewing moderator to potential problems. In this case, let's take a look at submission 5353339. The "Note" row has three columns. The leftmost one contains the value of the Note field as it currently exists in the database. The center column contains the value in the body of the submission. The rightmost column, "Warnings", displays any differences between them. In this case it's telling us that if this submission were re-approved, the Note line which currently says:

-<li>Novel ends on page 235. Dramatis Personae on pages 236-237. Glossary on pages 238-240

would be deleted. Similarly, a line starting with the "+" sign would indicate an about-to-added line. They are very useful when a submission changes something minor in a long list of notes.

We have additional safeguards in the software, e.g. any submission which references a deleted record cannot be approved, but for the most part we rely on the "Warnings" system to identify anything unusual. We can always tweak Warnings, e.g. in this case we could color-code "about-to-be-deleted" and "about-to-be-added" lines to make it easier for moderators to see what's going on. Ahasuerus 21:43, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Couple of points:
A) I wasn't aware that a submission could potentially affect so many records. I have a background in computer databases so I appreciate what you're saying about locking affected records: "it would be doable if we threw enough man-hours at it, but it would require a lot of work.". I accept that we just have to be aware of this situation and learn to live with it.
B) As you suggested, I took a look at submission 5353339 and could not believe my eyes. When I was first investigating this problem, I looked at the relevant submissions in the edit history and I will swear blind that this sub now looks different. Previously, it did not show the deletion:
-<li>Novel ends on page 235. Dramatis Personae on pages 236-237. Glossary on pages 238-240
in the Warnings column. Having thought about it, I think what has happened is that the current view of this sub has been changed by the subsequent submission 5355423 which Kraang made to restore this comment. So this means that at the time Kraang approved Mavmaramis' submission 5353339, the warning would not have been there. Is this deduction correct? Teallach 18:10, 4 July 2022 (EDT)

The Warnings column does a simple "diff" between what's currently (emphasis on "currently") in the Note field in the database and what's in the submission payload. Every time the Note value stored in the database changes, what the Warnings column displays changes. It's not particularly useful post-approval, but it helps the reviewing moderator determine the nature of the proposed change.

It saves a lot of time when the existing Note consists of a dozen+ lines and the change affects a single word or just a couple of characters. Prior to the implementation of the "diff" functionality, the reviewing moderator had to examine ever word, which was both time consuming and tiring. Ahasuerus 18:44, 4 July 2022 (EDT)

I have run into these types of issue many times. Usually with my own submissions being moderated out of submission order (it seems to be fairly common here to moderate in reverse order; I am sure that is some function of how the queue is displayed to moderators or some such). For example: I change a pub note fix some comments and then I make another change to the pub to update several fields including adding some information the pub note. Later they get moderated in reverse order and as a result the additions to the pub note are gone (but earlier comments are fixed) but the other additions to the pub record are still there. This is why I am always careful how I make submissions and wait for moderation before there are too many changes stacked upon one another. —Uzume (talk) 02:22, 7 September 2022 (EDT)

A Requiem for Homo Sapiens series.

Hello Kraang. I want to ask you about this series. Title pages on the trade paperback copies I bought recently have the "A Requiem for Homo Sapiens" as a subtitle on the title page - I made notes about that on the two publications from the series I own - so should the titles not be edited to relect this. I note that only one book in the sequence - and one specific edition - this one has it but in brackets. What do you think ? --Mavmaramis 15:00, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

We use to add these in the past, but no, series names in the title are not added, best to just leave a note about the title page.Kraang 16:04, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Alright. Thanks. --Mavmaramis 23:47, 3 July 2022 (EDT)

Two unanswered question from Moderator noticeboard

Hello Kraang. Sorry to bug you but two items I posted on the Mderator noticeboard have gone (as yet) unanswered.

1. I found an advert in the back of The Glass Teat refering to this book with blub, size (210 x 140mm) and giving the ISBN as 0 86130 005 X. No evidence this publication from Savoy ever appeared - it doesn't appear on Savoy's website listing of publications - nor does the ISBN appear to exist so should it not be listed as "unpublished" under Savoy's publisher page ?

I think it should be entered. Re Help page "8888-00-00 - The publication was announced (to be released in the past) but was not published." Just use the date in the example and it will appear as unpublished.

2. In reference to this map. It is signed "Arthur Conliffe" so should not not be his true name and "Artie" a variant ?

Best to check with the other PV's and see what their books say. It looks like they both imported the Artie name so maybe a variant needs to be created.Kraang 23:25, 8 July 2022 (EDT)

--Mavmaramis 12:14, 8 July 2022 (EDT)

Species Imperative titles

For Survival, would you mind if I change the page count to x+483 to match the book? I'll also add the WorldCat ID and replace the Amazon cover.

For Migration, would you mind if I change the page count to x+527 to match the book? I'll also add the WorldCat ID and replace the Amazon cover.

Thanks! Phil 08:16, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

The changes are fine. Thanks!Kraang 12:43, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

Edmund Cooper / Tomorrow's Gift

Posted on the talk pages of: Kraang, Willem H, Dirk P Broer, GlennMcG, Spacecow
I will be editing and PVing Tomorrow's Gift
1) the pub record has a contents entry "Brain Child". This matches the TOC but the title of the story on page 63 is "The Brain Child"
2) the pub record has a contents entry "M81-Ursa Major". This matches the TOC but the title of the story on page 95 is "M81: Ursa Major"
I will make the appropriate corrections and add pub notes regarding the discrepancies with the TOC Teallach 17:53, 16 August 2022 (EDT)

Ok by me, remember Brain Child is a variant and after the change it needs to be unmerged and remerged with the parent title.Kraang 22:39, 16 August 2022 (EDT)

My intention is to import the parent "The Brain Child" and then remove the variant "Brain Child". I believe that will avoid the need to unmerge / remerge. I need to make a further tweak to the Ursa Major story though. See this discussion on Spacecow's talk page about the space. Teallach 17:45, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

It can be done several ways, just remember to delete the empty title record it will generate.Kraang 22:19, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

Just remove the faulty titles (both are variants) and import the (existing) 'new' title records. The Brain Child is the canonical in this case. It will auto-merge. Just saw you opened a new can of worms with M81: Ursa Major...--Dirk P Broer 09:18, 18 August 2022 (EDT)

I have just submitted the first edit. You say "remember to delete the empty title record". I presume you are referring to "Brain Child". However, I won't be able to do this because it won't actually be empty. It will still be contained in one publication: the Canadian printing. It seems very likely that this pub record has corresponding errors but it has been PVd by an editor who is no longer active (Bluesman) so I cannot ask him. So I will just have to leave it alone. Teallach 18:32, 18 August 2022 (EDT)

I have numerous books of this era & later that are US & CDN printings & the contents are always the same. This was done as a trick to get around content rules involving duties & taxes on printed material. Change the other to match unless there is strong objection.Kraang 22:49, 18 August 2022 (EDT)

I have long suspected that US and Canadian printings of that era and later had identical contents but as I don't have the Canadian printing of Tomorrow's Gift, I can't PV it and another editor has PVd it so I was very reluctant to alter it. Nevertheless, based on your recommendation, I will now do so. These two pub records both require multiple edits so to assist myself in keeping track of where I am I will:
1) first make all the edits to the US printing
2) then make all the edits to the Canadian printing
3) then the title record for the variant "Brain Child" will be empty so I can delete it.
Teallach 13:51, 19 August 2022 (EDT)

Roger Robinson / Hale & Gresham Hardback Science(-)Fiction

Regarding my recent approved submission 5403728, I am now not sure how to create a title record with the hyphenated version of the title. Do I go to the title record for "Hale & Gresham Hardback Science Fiction" (ie the unhyphenated version) and use the "Add a Variant to this Title" tool? The associated help page states "avoid using this screen if possible". Can you please advise. Thank you. Teallach 19:12, 26 August 2022 (EDT)

The 1993 pamphlet is already hyphenated so just unmerge it and then make it a variant of the 1988 tp.Kraang 22:48, 26 August 2022 (EDT)

Thanks, I'm with it. Unmerge submitted. Teallach 08:06, 28 August 2022 (EDT)

I got confused and put "Tarzan no centro da Terra" but actually it was "Tarzan e o leão de ouro", translated of Tarzan and golden lion.Hyju 06:16, 3 September 2022 (EDT)

I see it, no problem, will approve the fix. Thanks.Kraang 11:28, 3 September 2022 (EDT)

Macmillan-era imprint Aladdin (Books)

Hi, Kraang. I have several Atheneum, Aladdin, Argo publisher updates in the queue from this week. One was approved by Anniemod two hours ago, Aladdin. In fact that new annotation fits only about 1% of 2000 publications. What do you think of this plan?

• by 15 or so publication updates, change the name of the Macmillan-era children's imprint, about 1984-1994 (which my Note covers), from Aladdin to Aladdin / Macmillan. That will leave about 2000 "Aladdin" records as broadly contemporaneous with >200 as "Aladdin Paperbacks / Simon & Schuster" and >30 as "Aladdin Paperbacks" representing the Simon & Schuster era, 1994 to date.
• annotate Aladdin / Macmillan, instead of Aladdin, by cut-and-paste with appropriate modification.
• annotate the three later Aladdin publisher/imprint records, perhaps only slightly as cross-reference to the predecessor.

--Pwendt|talk 16:53, 16 September 2022 (EDT)

I think we should proceed. If it helps, I can merge a publisher into one or the other name. As a moderator I have more leeway with publisher records.Kraang (talk) 21:14, 18 September 2022 (EDT)

I have started work toward such a change, by improving some publication records without yet change in publisher name. Just now two genuine Macmillan-era Aladdins thus (submissions 5431216 5431222).

For one, all of 0-671- ISBN may be mis-attributions to Aladdin during this era, because Simon & Schuster later reissued those as Aladdins. Anniemod may be approving that batch this hour.

Don't know if/when I'll be back to that today Friday. --Pwendt|talk 14:14, 23 September 2022 (EDT)

One small improvement is to rename the 1950s publisher Aladdin Books as Aladdin Books / American Book Company. The short name is an "attractive nuisance"; we should not expect to handle such nuisances adequately by publisher notes such as --in this case, at publisher Aladdin-- "The Atheneum lineage is not related to the older publisher Aladdin Books."

I suppose that you, as a moderator, can execute such a rename at https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/publisher.cgi?31303 --which will preserve the publisher ID 31303 and its current Webpages, Notes.

I will be able immediately to follow-up and complete such a rename. There is only one use of template link {publisher|Aladdin Books} and a few text references; and one is needed at American Book Company. --Pwendt|talk 14:37, 6 October 2022 (EDT)

renamed, only two books involved.Kraang (talk) 11:04, 7 October 2022 (EDT)

{outdent} Are you active this month? I expect to begin use of Aladdin Books / Macmillan (although Aladdin Books itself is now vacant). At least this weekend, all will be updates publications with LC catalog records as Aladdin Books, etc. --Pwendt|talk 12:15, 12 November 2022 (EST)

Initially two: submission 5485515 and 5485518. When approved I will re-write and re-link as appropriate at publishers Aladdin / Atheneum; Aladdin; Aladdin Paperbacks / Simon & Schuster. --Pwendt|talk 13:27, 12 November 2022 (EST)

Dick ~ Tubb / The Man Who Japed ~ The Space-Born

Posted on the talk pages of active PVs.
I am editing and PVing The Man Who Japed ~ The Space-Born and propose to change the date from 1956-00-00 to 1956-12-00 and add a pub note stating the source: Galactic Central Bibliography. I will also add the month to the associated records (title and coverart). I will be adding the month to several other PKD books in the near future. Teallach (talk) 16:45, 27 October 2022 (EDT)

That's fine with me. Thanks!Kraang (talk) 11:57, 29 October 2022 (EDT)